Top whale power rankings

Is it just me or does this seem like a horribly bad idea? There has been tension for quite a while with the free players disliking the balance between whales and non-whales, and this just seems like pouring oil on the fire. The rankings do nothing but add permanent exclusive rewards for the whales that get the highest stats, and it should be obvious that people won't have a lot of chance of competing as a free player. The rewards aren't fully cosmetic, so that just seems like it's rubbing the difference between whales and non-whales in even more? Why would they release it this way despite knowing that there is already a lot of tension between part of the free players and the whales?

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Comments

  • 5WGN7KY7XK5WGN7KY7XK Member
    edited June 2018

    The rewards for rank 1-3 TCP leaderboard (eye/effect wings) should be time-limited, or make it so that people who already received the rewards ineligible for the leaderboard for the rest of the month. Otherwise the rankings are just going to be dominated by the same people with 1.2m TCP every week, especially for characters with the most whales like Yuri and Tina, and players with slightly lower TCP would never have a chance at the rewards. Another method would be for the top 3 whales to willingly relinquish their spot to the other players but that's extremely unlikely because who would give up their chance to flex?

    Player ranking systems in MMOs are always unfair and they literally make the game P2W.

  • @5WGN7KY7XK said:
    The rewards for rank 1-3 TCP leaderboard (eye/effect wings) should be time-limited, or make it so that people who already received the rewards ineligible for the leaderboard for the rest of the month. Otherwise the rankings are just going to be dominated by the same people with 1.2m TCP every week, especially for characters with the most whales like Yuri and Tina, and players with slightly lower TCP would never have a chance at the rewards. Another method would be for the top 3 whales to willingly relinquish their spot to the other players but that's extremely unlikely because who would give up their chance to flex?

    Player ranking systems in MMOs are always unfair and they literally make the game P2W.

    The coins you get from the rankings lets you craft permanent stuff, including a permanent version of the iris. The ones from the ranking itself are temp, but the ones you can craft aren't.

  • Personally, I think they spent money on the game unlike us freeloaders so give 'em something to brag about >.>

  • @SandersLMAO said:
    Personally, I think they spent money on the game unlike us freeloaders so give 'em something to brag about >.>

    Giving them something to brag about could be done without giving them permanent non-cosmetic rewards though. I wouldn't see any issue with it if it wasn't for that. It isn't about them having something to brag about, it's about them getting something non-cosmetic that can never be obtained within reason by a free player. All it does is create a rift between the groups.

  • not a problem at all everyone gets something from this anyway

  • matirionmatirion Member
    edited June 2018

    @Natorious said:
    not a problem at all everyone gets something from this anyway

    What do people that aren't in the top 10 get from it? Nothing. So how does everyone get something from it?

  • @matirion said:

    @Natorious said:
    not a problem at all everyone gets something from this anyway

    What do people that aren't in the top 10 get from it? Nothing. So how does everyone get something from it?

    you will get a buff once they are displayed on the pedestal

  • matirionmatirion Member
    edited June 2018

    @Natorious said:

    @matirion said:

    @Natorious said:
    not a problem at all everyone gets something from this anyway

    What do people that aren't in the top 10 get from it? Nothing. So how does everyone get something from it?

    you will get a buff once they are displayed on the pedestal

    So that means free players get a whole lot of nothing from the rankings then. The buff is meaningless in this, because it isn't actually a part of the ranking rewards. The rankings give rewards to whales that can not be obtained otherwise, while the buff will be given regardless of what happens to the rankings. Even if the top 10 got nothing at all from the rankings, the buff would still be given out. Free players get nothing from the rankings, only the top 10 does.

    The only people getting something from the rankings are the top 10.

  • @matirion said:

    @Natorious said:

    @matirion said:

    @Natorious said:
    not a problem at all everyone gets something from this anyway

    What do people that aren't in the top 10 get from it? Nothing. So how does everyone get something from it?

    you will get a buff once they are displayed on the pedestal

    So that means free players get a whole lot of nothing from the rankings then. The buff is meaningless in this, because it isn't actually a part of the ranking rewards. The rankings give rewards to whales that can not be obtained otherwise, while the buff will be given regardless of what happens to the rankings. Even if the top 10 got nothing at all from the rankings, the buff would still be given out. Free players get nothing from the rankings, only the top 10 does.

    The only people getting something from the rankings are the top 10.

    Every buff for a free to play player is nice. Whales or no whales everyone worked for their character gear stats etc. It isn't by any means game breaking.

    Game gives our free shit way to often it seems lol

  • @matirion said:
    Is it just me or does this seem like a horribly bad idea? There has been tension for quite a while with the free players disliking the balance between whales and non-whales, and this just seems like pouring oil on the fire. The rankings do nothing but add permanent exclusive rewards for the whales that get the highest stats, and it should be obvious that people won't have a lot of chance of competing as a free player. The rewards aren't fully cosmetic, so that just seems like it's rubbing the difference between whales and non-whales in even more? Why would they release it this way despite knowing that there is already a lot of tension between part of the free players and the whales?

    please just stop with that spouting nonsense crap, there's no tension between f2p and Veteran players like you said (Dont spread nonsense rumours), i have a friend bought only the Trainee Bundle during CBT and now he's at the upper ranks of the Total Power Rankings, and it's because of his hard work he became top total combat player and you think that all members of the TPR are whales? geez dont whine too much.
    I'm just recently joined this game I think this TPR Exists in all Closers Region (Kr,NA,Indo,JP,CH) and you want to change it just because you think this is unfair for the F2p players? AND IT THE END IT IS JUST A COSMETICS DUDE fix your crap together
    dont whine like a little kid

    Calling the Attention of the EME Staffs : this OP is ruining the game

  • @matirion said:

    @SandersLMAO said:
    Personally, I think they spent money on the game unlike us freeloaders so give 'em something to brag about >.>

    Giving them something to brag about could be done without giving them permanent non-cosmetic rewards though. I wouldn't see any issue with it if it wasn't for that. It isn't about them having something to brag about, it's about them getting something non-cosmetic that can never be obtained within reason by a free player. All it does is create a rift between the groups.

    you are just creating an issue by making f2p players read this to hate your so called "Whales"
    PLEASE STOP

  • Personally, I'm quite thankful that this so called "Whales" are here. They're paying for the game, which means income to the devs/publishers. That way the game would last for a longtime. Hopefully :)

  • BunnyBunny Member, Player Moderators, Player Council

  • Okay lets discuss.

    @matirion said:
    There has been tension for quite a while with the free players disliking the balance between whales and non-whales, and this just seems like pouring oil on the fire.

    Is there proof of this tension that you speak of between whales and non-whales? Or is it anecdotal? Pardon my ignorance but I've only been playing since March and besides the few posts in the General Discussion section of this forum, I've never really seen any strong beef between whales and non-whales.

    @matirion said:
    The rankings do nothing but add permanent exclusive rewards for the whales that get the highest stats.

    The rankings also add permeanent exclusive rewards for the non-whales that get the highest stats. What's the point of striving to be top 10 if there are no rewards? Of course they're exclusive, they're freaking top 10 in the whole game! And before you tell me that i'm missing the point you're trying to get, your statement is completely based on the fact that only whales are allowed top 10. Like its literally impossible for non-whales to qualify for top 10.

    I have a seha friend who is top 10 TCP and has never bought EMP before in his life. What now? This point alone should invalidate all your concerns in this thread.

    @matirion said:
    And it should be obvious that people won't have a lot of chance of competing as a free player.

    Yes they won't have a lot of chance to compete because they're always gonna be behind in credits and EB2 and whatever enhancement materials but they'll get there eventually, no? So what's the problem? Its too slow? You want F2P players to reach extreme hyper late game gear as fast as whales when they don't spend a single dime? It just sounds ridiculous to me.

    @matirion said:
    The rewards aren't fully cosmetic, so that just seems like it's rubbing the difference between whales and non-whales in even more?

    From what I've checked, they are fully-cosmetic dear sir/madam. Braziers are for house decoration, the 2 set effect gives a nice cosmetic aura. Visual frame ticket is the frame surrounding their character's face in loading screens. For the titles, I'm actually not so sure if it has combat benefits (i've got no one to confirm this with until someone receives their reward). Even if the 2 piece set effect has tunings, i'm pretty sure that the 'whales' have other more useful accesories and would place them in the non-cosmetic slot.

    @matirion said:
    Why would they release it this way despite knowing that there is already a lot of tension between part of the free players and the whales?

    As mentioned, where is this tension? Show me something solid, because I ain't feeling anything!

    @matirion said:

    @SandersLMAO said:
    Personally, I think they spent money on the game unlike us freeloaders so give 'em something to brag about >.>

    Giving them something to brag about could be done without giving them permanent non-cosmetic rewards though. I wouldn't see any issue with it if it wasn't for that. It isn't about them having something to brag about, it's about them getting something non-cosmetic that can never be obtained within reason by a free player. All it does is create a rift between the groups.

    Okay I strongly agree with the 2nd post dude that there should be some tweaks to the way the rewards work, especially the part of: "The rewards for rank 1-3 TCP leaderboard (eye/effect wings) should be time-limited, or make it so that people who already received the rewards ineligible for the leaderboard for the rest of the month."

    Like I've said, the rewards are cosmetic, so there should'nt be an issue here.

  • BunnyBunny Member, Player Moderators, Player Council

    Above is a perfect example of how this attack power ranking system promotes an unhealthy number crunching play style. You see this Tina goes for any random S tune like Psi Power, Air Strike for the Total attack power ranking. Yes, they have a choice to choose stats for ranking and stats for efficiency, but why must a player be forced into this scenario? Why create such a system that wasn't fully thought out? The current system is awful and could use a revamp.

  • @RF65RJYN77 said:

    @matirion said:
    Is it just me or does this seem like a horribly bad idea? There has been tension for quite a while with the free players disliking the balance between whales and non-whales, and this just seems like pouring oil on the fire. The rankings do nothing but add permanent exclusive rewards for the whales that get the highest stats, and it should be obvious that people won't have a lot of chance of competing as a free player. The rewards aren't fully cosmetic, so that just seems like it's rubbing the difference between whales and non-whales in even more? Why would they release it this way despite knowing that there is already a lot of tension between part of the free players and the whales?

    please just stop with that spouting nonsense crap, there's no tension between f2p and Veteran players like you said (Dont spread nonsense rumours), i have a friend bought only the Trainee Bundle during CBT and now he's at the upper ranks of the Total Power Rankings, and it's because of his hard work he became top total combat player and you think that all members of the TPR are whales? geez dont whine too much.
    I'm just recently joined this game I think this TPR Exists in all Closers Region (Kr,NA,Indo,JP,CH) and you want to change it just because you think this is unfair for the F2p players? AND IT THE END IT IS JUST A COSMETICS DUDE fix your crap together
    dont whine like a little kid

    Calling the Attention of the EME Staffs : this OP is ruining the game

    Whales and veteran players are completely different. Whales spend craptons of money vets is mostly time played.
    Otherwise I agree.

  • @Adorable said:

    Above is a perfect example of how this attack power ranking system promotes an unhealthy number crunching play style. You see this Tina goes for any random S tune like Psi Power, Air Strike for the Total attack power ranking. Yes, they have a choice to choose stats for ranking and stats for efficiency, but why must a player be forced into this scenario? Why create such a system that wasn't fully thought out? The current system is awful and could use a revamp.

    I think this begets another thread of its own. It's a different issue from OP's

  • BunnyBunny Member, Player Moderators, Player Council

    @SandersLMAO said:

    @Adorable said:

    Above is a perfect example of how this attack power ranking system promotes an unhealthy number crunching play style. You see this Tina goes for any random S tune like Psi Power, Air Strike for the Total attack power ranking. Yes, they have a choice to choose stats for ranking and stats for efficiency, but why must a player be forced into this scenario? Why create such a system that wasn't fully thought out? The current system is awful and could use a revamp.

    I think this begets another thread of its own. It's a different issue from OP's

    Yeah, I can see that it's slightlly could be different from the OP's,but in a way is similar as well. There's another thread too where they want reduced cost for the TCP reward crafts. I didn't want a bunch of TCP threads and this was very close to what I can branch off on since it's regarding how it's a bad idea.

  • IwynIwyn Member
    edited June 2018

    Whats even worst is that the update made it sound like it was something to look forward to, by all players. ALL. When they know damn well its just a way to make whales stack useless S tunes and more just to look better and declare theyre better. As if everyone would want to do that.

  • In the end though, it all comes down to skill. Even if you're a "Whale", you can't beat a Veteran if you don't fully grasp your characters strengths and weaknesses. Even if "Whales" do have better gear, their equipments aren't that far of from a Veteran's. The endgear is practically the same except for same minor differences. So I quote from every DS fans out there, "Git Gud". :D (And by no means am I a whale or a veteran( just started last month). It's just personal opinion.)

  • I'm salty about that effect wing though.
    however spending money in this game only speeds things up and f2p players can get anything(Except some small things like costume slots :disappointed:)

  • MuonMuon Member

    If they chaned how TCP works Mahou shoujo Tina wont be possible anymore :neutral:

  • NoxObscuraNoxObscura Member
    edited June 2018

    Holy crap, is this what people are up in arms about? I just got home from work and... It's an Eye color and wing effect. Neither of those are "pay to win" The top 10 of each closer just has a chance to look different than everyone else. That's not a big deal really.

    It would be pay to win if say being Rank 1 gave you a unique costume weapon that added 20% physical/psi power and 50% crit damage. But no, that's not what the top players are getting. The cosmetics are basically just visual bragging rights, so you can see straight away if that person is a "top" player, rather than having to click on them and inspect their TCP manually to see if they're the strongest.

  • @NoxObscura said:
    Holy crap, is this what people are up in arms about? I just got home from work and... It's an Eye color and wing effect. Neither of those are "pay to win" The top 10 of each closer just has a chance to look different than everyone else. That's not a big deal really.

    It would be pay to win if say being Rank 1 gave you a unique costume weapon that added 20% physical/psi power and 50% crit damage. But no, that's not what the top players are getting. The cosmetics are basically just visual bragging rights, so you can see straight away if that person is a "top" player, rather than having to click on them and inspect their TCP manually to see if they're the strongest.

    Are you new to MMOs? You do realize that playing dress-up is just as important to players as gear? It doesn't matter if the
    power ranking rewards are purely cosmetics. It's pretty unfair that only a very limited amount of players will have access to items. Those items are literally unobtainable to 99% of the player base. And to make it worse, whales are receiving these ranking rewards for doing absolutely nothing other than throwing money at the screen. Arena and Hall of Dragon Rankings are well-designed ranking systems because they actually reward you for having some sort of skill with your character.

  • Are you new to MMOs? You do realize that playing dress-up is just as important to players as gear? It doesn't matter if the
    power ranking rewards are purely cosmetics. It's pretty unfair that only a very limited amount of players will have access to items. Those items are literally unobtainable to 99% of the player base.

    Are you new to Closers? You do realize that Total Power Ranking Exists in ALL CLOSERS Server, That's why IT IS CALLED A TOTAL POWER RANKINGS (It's only LIMITED TO THE TOP PLAYERS WHALES OR NOT)
    THERE ARE TONS OF COSTUMES EME GIVAWAYS (YUKATAS, EVENT OUTFITS , DROPPABLE WINGS, EYE) ETC.

    And to make it worse, whales are receiving these ranking rewards for doing absolutely nothing other than throwing money at the screen.

    THEN HOW CLOSERS GONNA SURVIVE IF WE ALL ARE ONLY PLAYING FREE? ARE YOU SURE THAT THEY ARE DOING ABSOLUTELY NOTHING? , THEY'RE ALLOTING TIME TO PLAY , THEY'RE FARMING TOO, MAKING SURE THAT THEY'RE THE BEST OF THE BEST

    EME STAFF SHOULD FILTER THESE KINDS OF SALTY PLAYERS FOR RUINING THE COMMUNITY.

  • @Mahouroa said:

    @NoxObscura said:
    Holy crap, is this what people are up in arms about? I just got home from work and... It's an Eye color and wing effect. Neither of those are "pay to win" The top 10 of each closer just has a chance to look different than everyone else. That's not a big deal really.

    It would be pay to win if say being Rank 1 gave you a unique costume weapon that added 20% physical/psi power and 50% crit damage. But no, that's not what the top players are getting. The cosmetics are basically just visual bragging rights, so you can see straight away if that person is a "top" player, rather than having to click on them and inspect their TCP manually to see if they're the strongest.

    Are you new to MMOs? You do realize that playing dress-up is just as important to players as gear? It doesn't matter if the
    power ranking rewards are purely cosmetics. It's pretty unfair that only a very limited amount of players will have access to items. Those items are literally unobtainable to 99% of the player base. And to make it worse, whales are receiving these ranking rewards for doing absolutely nothing other than throwing money at the screen. Arena and Hall of Dragon Rankings are well-designed ranking systems because they actually reward you for having some sort of skill with your character.

    I'm not new to MMOs, I've been playing different ones since 2005. So I understand that people like to make their characters look pretty. Heck, in other MMOs, some people didn't even level up. They just dressed their characters up and talked to people in-game. But missing out on two cosmetic items does not warrant all of this melodrama. It spawned two threads almost immediately, complaining about the unfairness. It's not a perfect rewards system, but it's not the end of the world either. To me, complaining about it being "unfair" is the equivalent of saying it's unfair for Bugatti to make a cool looking Chiron that a majority of people can't afford. That's just a part of life. There are just some things that will be beyond your means.

  • @Adorable said:
    I was personally against the idea of this coming to NA/EU, but it's inevitable. The system is straight up awful. if you are competing on the rankings the system forces a person to stack on stats that does not benefit you.

    I don't care about "Top Whales rating", however, i do agree that this "Total Combat Power" is straight up garbage, better than old DPS/s, but still goddamn awful.

  • @RF65RJYN77 said:

    Are you new to MMOs? You do realize that playing dress-up is just as important to players as gear? It doesn't matter if the
    power ranking rewards are purely cosmetics. It's pretty unfair that only a very limited amount of players will have access to items. Those items are literally unobtainable to 99% of the player base.

    Are you new to Closers? You do realize that Total Power Ranking Exists in ALL CLOSERS Server, That's why IT IS CALLED A TOTAL POWER RANKINGS (It's only LIMITED TO THE TOP PLAYERS WHALES OR NOT)
    THERE ARE TONS OF COSTUMES EME GIVAWAYS (YUKATAS, EVENT OUTFITS , DROPPABLE WINGS, EYE) ETC.

    And to make it worse, whales are receiving these ranking rewards for doing absolutely nothing other than throwing money at the screen.

    THEN HOW CLOSERS GONNA SURVIVE IF WE ALL ARE ONLY PLAYING FREE? ARE YOU SURE THAT THEY ARE DOING ABSOLUTELY NOTHING? , THEY'RE ALLOTING TIME TO PLAY , THEY'RE FARMING TOO, MAKING SURE THAT THEY'RE THE BEST OF THE BEST

    EME STAFF SHOULD FILTER THESE KINDS OF SALTY PLAYERS FOR RUINING THE COMMUNITY.

    Firstly, it's clear you're new to online forums, otherwise you would be aware that using all caps is poor typing etiquette and makes it look like you're screaming at your monitor. Secondly, how is Total Power Ranking being present in all severs relevant at all? It doesn't change the fact that it's a poorly designed reward system. Lastly, it is very well possible to criticize faults in the game and not be "salty" and the fact that you believe these types of discussions should be filtered is laughable.

  • @NoxObscura said:

    @Mahouroa said:

    @NoxObscura said:
    Holy crap, is this what people are up in arms about? I just got home from work and... It's an Eye color and wing effect. Neither of those are "pay to win" The top 10 of each closer just has a chance to look different than everyone else. That's not a big deal really.

    It would be pay to win if say being Rank 1 gave you a unique costume weapon that added 20% physical/psi power and 50% crit damage. But no, that's not what the top players are getting. The cosmetics are basically just visual bragging rights, so you can see straight away if that person is a "top" player, rather than having to click on them and inspect their TCP manually to see if they're the strongest.

    Are you new to MMOs? You do realize that playing dress-up is just as important to players as gear? It doesn't matter if the
    power ranking rewards are purely cosmetics. It's pretty unfair that only a very limited amount of players will have access to items. Those items are literally unobtainable to 99% of the player base. And to make it worse, whales are receiving these ranking rewards for doing absolutely nothing other than throwing money at the screen. Arena and Hall of Dragon Rankings are well-designed ranking systems because they actually reward you for having some sort of skill with your character.

    I'm not new to MMOs, I've been playing different ones since 2005. So I understand that people like to make their characters look pretty. Heck, in other MMOs, some people didn't even level up. They just dressed their characters up and talked to people in-game. But missing out on two cosmetic items does not warrant all of this melodrama. It spawned two threads almost immediately, complaining about the unfairness. It's not a perfect rewards system, but it's not the end of the world either. To me, complaining about it being "unfair" is the equivalent of saying it's unfair for Bugatti to make a cool looking Chiron that a majority of people can't afford. That's just a part of life. There are just some things that will be beyond your means.

    I think you're over exaggerating how much of a "big deal" people are making out of the ranking rewards. Players aren't threatening to quit or boycott the game. And I get that "life isn't fair", but that doesn't mean we should just abandon any efforts and attempts to make a game as fair as possible. The developers can easily create a better reward system that actually rewards the player for doing something and give every player a fair chance at obtaining the rewards.

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