Removal of Fatigue on July 3 and Violet Release???

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Comments

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @IDoNotMainJ said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:
    Economy will be similar to C.C, i dont play that private server but afaik they have this stamina crafting pills without any limits, so its like no stamina-system for them. I doubt they are as inflated as Japan official server. Our economy is going to be inflated anyway with or without stamina. There is absolutely no way you can stop that. The rate is indeed going to be faster but who knows Japan would still take the cake as the most inflated server even though they have stamina system inplace.

    As long as they dont remove daily limits we will be fine. Daily limits + stamina system are just too much. Stamina right now offers nothing but limiting new players catching up with veterans faster, it is better if we have more players at end game. New players are abandoning this game because of continuous pause on their playtime even though they want to play more. If theyre not playing this game then most likely they are playing other games and this add to risk they would abandon Closes altogether, or may even forget Closers exists.

    About botting, i doubt you can bot this game out. You need gears from raids that needs human intervention, there is no way you can bot that, even humans are dying nonstop what more on automated bots. If their bots dont have gears then they cant automate them to farm in place where highly sought out items exist (Effect wings). You also need to configure all the stats, skills and make the bot run all those complicated story quests before they can reach high lvls. So i think bots dont exist in this game. What you see in world chat are just phishing site to hack gullible whale players.

    They LITERALLY throw stam pots at you while leveling... I played for close to 18 hours when harpy came out and was close to full char fatigue once.. why? Stam.pots they throw at you IN HANDFULLS

    If they throw stamina pills like no tomorrow how does that anyway different to no-stamina at all? Also not everyone are going to play during events where mostly likely you enjoyed. If a newbie started without stamina pills events they will have to play another games unless you want them to play closers only to stare at their monitor.

    I don't know how it requires this much difficult brain power to understand that if they have to give out pills, then there's a cap to what can be done. if there's no pills needed, then there's no cap to what can happen.

    You dont have to result to insult and personal level to make your point out lol. THAT CAP is the very reason theyre changing the system because it only annoyed those new players out of the game.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

  • @Muon said:

    @IDoNotMainJ said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:
    Economy will be similar to C.C, i dont play that private server but afaik they have this stamina crafting pills without any limits, so its like no stamina-system for them. I doubt they are as inflated as Japan official server. Our economy is going to be inflated anyway with or without stamina. There is absolutely no way you can stop that. The rate is indeed going to be faster but who knows Japan would still take the cake as the most inflated server even though they have stamina system inplace.

    As long as they dont remove daily limits we will be fine. Daily limits + stamina system are just too much. Stamina right now offers nothing but limiting new players catching up with veterans faster, it is better if we have more players at end game. New players are abandoning this game because of continuous pause on their playtime even though they want to play more. If theyre not playing this game then most likely they are playing other games and this add to risk they would abandon Closes altogether, or may even forget Closers exists.

    About botting, i doubt you can bot this game out. You need gears from raids that needs human intervention, there is no way you can bot that, even humans are dying nonstop what more on automated bots. If their bots dont have gears then they cant automate them to farm in place where highly sought out items exist (Effect wings). You also need to configure all the stats, skills and make the bot run all those complicated story quests before they can reach high lvls. So i think bots dont exist in this game. What you see in world chat are just phishing site to hack gullible whale players.

    They LITERALLY throw stam pots at you while leveling... I played for close to 18 hours when harpy came out and was close to full char fatigue once.. why? Stam.pots they throw at you IN HANDFULLS

    If they throw stamina pills like no tomorrow how does that anyway different to no-stamina at all? Also not everyone are going to play during events where mostly likely you enjoyed. If a newbie started without stamina pills events they will have to play another games unless you want them to play closers only to stare at their monitor.

    I don't know how it requires this much difficult brain power to understand that if they have to give out pills, then there's a cap to what can be done. if there's no pills needed, then there's no cap to what can happen.

    You dont have to result to insult and personal level to make your point out lol. THAT CAP is the very reason theyre changing the system because it only annoyed those new players out of the game.

    It annoyed new players because they didn't give the game a week for them to get to their 1190 Fatigue while they're upset with the 190 starting fatigue.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    Japan has stamina system because they didn't remove the bar, but they have infinte stamina because you can be 100 stamina potions for 100k

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

  • doggoddoggod Member

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    ...theres botting in world of Warcraft... theres your evidence

  • Well I suppose I was lucky enough to somehow join a boat with a bot in Vindictus and guess what:
    All they did was go through walls and ohko all mobs

    Trust me Vindictus is much more complex than this game and if there were an overload of bots like that in that game then imagine how it would be here.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @IDoNotMainJ said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    Japan has stamina system because they didn't remove the bar, but they have infinte stamina because you can be 100 stamina potions for 100k

    If JP have stamina system then it is wrong comparison to our current server. If you want to compare JP it has to be from other servers that have stamina + craftable stamina pots. JP bypassing daily limits by going through giving tons malek boxes will have major impact than removing stamina itself. As long as emasse dont imitate that free cash to players we will be fine.

  • @Pokechu said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Pokechu said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Pokechu said:
    I just realized that fatigue removal also means I can play Violet exclusively forever!

    You could have before hand basically...

    I'd easily blow through all her stamina in one day and then all I'd be able to do for the rest of the week is PvP and spec ops. spec ops are so shit now, pls no

    I did that with harpy and just used the many many many stam pots they literally throw at you

    I got about 4000 stamina worth of potions saved up. Those wouldn't last very long for me, trust me.

    Do you intend to not leave your computer for a week straight?

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

  • @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    +1 I'd love to see proof that gold botting can't happen in Closers as well. because these MMOAH bots really make me think they're proving the point that it can happen.

  • BunnyBunny Member, Player Moderators, Player Council

    WOOO I LOVE THIS NEW CHANGE. THANK YOU ENMASSE. Doing the right thing here for the players. :3

  • Adorable... no.

  • @Pokechu said:

    @SuspiciousScout said:

    @Pokechu said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Pokechu said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Pokechu said:
    I just realized that fatigue removal also means I can play Violet exclusively forever!

    You could have before hand basically...

    I'd easily blow through all her stamina in one day and then all I'd be able to do for the rest of the week is PvP and spec ops. spec ops are so shit now, pls no

    I did that with harpy and just used the many many many stam pots they literally throw at you

    I got about 4000 stamina worth of potions saved up. Those wouldn't last very long for me, trust me.

    Do you intend to not leave your computer for a week straight?

    Yes.

    I've been waiting for this for more than half a year. No-lifing for 2 or 3 days a week can't hurt.

    But now everything's in the process of falling apart.

    Like me and harpy xD

  • IwynIwyn Member

    @FireZero said:
    @Iwyn wb

    ty ty

  • I for one am also against the Stamina/Fatigue removal... I do want to stress out that I'm all for character fatigue... not so much the account fatigue but I digress.... Spamming late game dungeons and not needing to worry about Stamina... the market is gonna get a bit of an inflation since credits will soon become easier.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    Ok if it is closers then how about you start giving solid facts now? It would be easy since you have first hand experience with them. But i believe you dont have, you only have claim. Me not providing facts about this game being unbotable doesnt justify that bots exist.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    Ok if it is closers then how about you start giving solid facts now? It would be easy since you have first hand experience with them. But i believe you dont have, you only have claim. Me not providing facts about this game being unbotable doesnt justify that bots exist.

    Be as skeptical as you want. I have seen it. Thanks for the non answer

  • GaivanGaivan Member

    Please, En Masse, do NOT remove the fatigue system. We are already having the issue with the goldfarm spambots popping up, but this will destroy the in-game economy and let farm bots run rampant. The system works perfectly fine as it is. It does not need to be changed. DFO got rid of their fatigue system and it cost them everything. I do not want to see Closers go down that same road. It will undoubtedly kill off this game.

  • @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    Ok if it is closers then how about you start giving solid facts now? It would be easy since you have first hand experience with them. But i believe you dont have, you only have claim. Me not providing facts about this game being unbotable doesnt justify that bots exist.

    You think highly of this game. There's no such thing as perfect unflawed program/code. You just need a good hack/programmer to put a little effort and this game can be totally botted.

  • MuonMuon Member

    @Smexinator said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    Ok if it is closers then how about you start giving solid facts now? It would be easy since you have first hand experience with them. But i believe you dont have, you only have claim. Me not providing facts about this game being unbotable doesnt justify that bots exist.

    You think highly of this game. There's no such thing as perfect unflawed program/code. You just need a good hack/programmer to put a little effort and this game can be totally botted.

    @mistressj have solid facts, i wanna see that or better yet bring it to enmasse, rather than supposition. It only look liked that theyre using this botting thing to show disgust to stamina system even though they dont exist in our game. If botters exist in our game it should be presented with facts because that is a claim. Botting from other games is not an argument either lol. Thats slippery slope.

  • mistressjmistressj Member
    edited June 2018

    @Muon said:

    @Smexinator said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @mistressj said:

    @Muon said:

    @Draciusen said:

    tl;dr-

    Gold farming is very real and very serious issue for a game's economy. If EnMasse wants to remove stamina, they're going to have to put more than twice the effort the gold farmers are willing to put into farming if they want to combat it. And they have to do so before it even becomes an issue.

    So these thousands of accounts farming on this specific low lvl area never leave any trace to server logs? Fatigue is only one of the many anti-botting features of this game, removing one will certainly not make this game botting friendly. Youre saying this game is not mechanically difficult but that is just opinion, you have to present this botters to prove the claim that it is easy.

    Yeah and gl banning THOUSANDS of accounts without catching legit players in the cross fire. It WILL make enmasse's job a whole lot difficult.

    If thousands of botters already exists and botting in the game, how come we dont see innocent players getting banned for wrong reasons? Maybe, these botters never leave any traces in the server so Enmasse never banned them?

    Because they are limited with the fatigue so it isn't a huge issue.... remove all the fatigue it will balloon to a major issue...

    So we currently have thousands of botters in the game, but somehow it is not a huge issue, even though they DO leave traces to server. But if we remove this stamina system the problem will be deteriorated even more so those botting traces in the sever will banished?

    Omg just quit before you fall even more behind. Your responses are nonsensical at this point.

    It was your logic not mine lol. I only translated your response. Thats why i also find them nonsensical as you do from your replies.

    So where have I mentioned anything close to bots leaving traces on the server besides my original statement including innocent players being caught and accidentally banned in the process? So remind me how is that my logic?

    I literally told you my.logic. the fatigue keeps the gold botters in check.mostly. remove it enmasse will need to have people dedicated to banning them(likely). If the inflating of the market can happen in vindictus DUE TO BOTTING and it being a much larger technical challenge for said botters or hackers it WILL happen to Closers. Look at JPs market if you need proof.

    Thats why Im telling you they do leave traces specially theyre concentrated at few maps in lower levels. So Botting will be filter out. Thats even saying that botting is possible in the first place where you dont have proof other than giving opinions that they do exist.

    JP have stamina system in place afaik, (i dont play there) I believe. According to guildmate that is playing there, the malek boxes are being given left and right easily and virtually events that give tons of money. It doesnt have to do with stamina.

    I had a friend irl that botted.I have witnessed it. It is far simpler than you think.

    Im very familiar with botting as well. From Clash of Clans to all the way back in Ragnarok days, thats why with closers complexity it would be impossible, unless you can stop giving imagination and start producing evidence from our game.

    So seeing my friends char running itself while at my friends house WHILE HE WASN'T AT THE PC my imagination? -slow claps- almost made me believe you can actually hold up your point without killing your own argument.

    Then try it to closers then? Youre giving example from other game even though they dont exist on our server. Just because they do exist from other games they will do so from our game. You have to prove that first.

    Um I'm literally talking Closers right now. And oh I was supposed to record that? How about you prove how gold botting CANT happen?

    Ok if it is closers then how about you start giving solid facts now? It would be easy since you have first hand experience with them. But i believe you dont have, you only have claim. Me not providing facts about this game being unbotable doesnt justify that bots exist.

    You think highly of this game. There's no such thing as perfect unflawed program/code. You just need a good hack/programmer to put a little effort and this game can be totally botted.

    @mistressj have solid facts, i wanna see that or better yet bring it to enmasse, rather than supposition. It only look liked that theyre using this botting thing to show disgust to stamina system even though they dont exist in our game. If botters exist in our game it should be presented with facts because that is a claim. Botting from other games is not an argument either lol. Thats slippery slope.

    -rolls eyes- ok time to stalk him and provide video facts. And PLEASE PROVE to me botting can't happen.. if you can't just go away and I will do the same. Way I see it is if you can't prove they can't exist in this game your argument is JUST as faulty as mine

  • @Adorable said:
    WOOO I LOVE THIS NEW CHANGE. THANK YOU ENMASSE. Doing the right thing here for the players. :3

    that wasn't in the agreement :L


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