Will there be unlimited stamina for this version of the game? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

124

Comments

  • SeimoreSeimore Member
    edited August 2017

    Honestly, a player ran economy sounds more harmful than unlim stamina does.
    I doubt that'd be removed, but if it were to be, would unlim stamina be a problem then?

    In all seriousness, bots can't be a problem if there is no economy to ruin. I don't know how this game works or if people sell items from the Cash Shop in game and stuff, but, how would that change the game? Veering a bit off topic, but the two ideas seem to be very linked as of now.

  • @Seimore said:
    Honestly, a player ran economy sounds more harmful than unlim stamina does.
    I doubt that'd be removed, but if it were to be, would unlim stamina be a problem then?

    In all seriousness, bots can't be a problem if there is no economy to ruin. I don't know how this game works or if people sell items from the Cash Shop in game and stuff, but, how would that change the game? Veering a bit off topic, but the two ideas seem to be very linked as of now.

    You guys still dont understand. unlimited stamina is bad. It will make the prices horrible. Even if bots dont exist.The prices will still be op. The amount of Credit that bots will get from farming and the auction house will be pretty a mess. So i think to avoid that is just have stamina. Alot of people do want stamina. Because the consequences are pretty much cant be reverted. I mean i do like unlimited stamina. Trust me . But there will be a sacrfice if we get unlimited stamina. Which are worst than having Limited stamina.

  • @ActuallyEndgame said:

    @Rucellex said:
    Again Unlimited stamina is very unlikely as the KR version has Stamina

    Nope. Removing Stamina from NA versions of kMMOs is the norm.

    Honestly, Vindictus destroys most of these pro-Stamina arguments. NA released with the token system. Nexon NA gave us unlimited tokens "for a month". Then they flat out removed the token system.

    .....And none of the things the pro-Stamina say would happen happened. In part because everything valuable comes from raids/Hero stages that are too hard for bots to farm. (In Closers, all the stuff you WOULD want to buy from the Black Market besides costumes and accessories are bound to character. No buying purple hexagons or goblets, you gotta grind for them yourself. You can't even bank share them to your other characters.)

    Again your info is non-sense and completely irrelevant. Those are 2 different games. Closers is not designed to have unlimited stamina . Seriously.. Its like your playing Closers ( Private server) . Seriously. It feels freaking horrible, boring and server destructing. Both limited and unlimited stamina have disadvantage and advantages. However unlimited stamina will surely kill the game and cause very Not so 'nice' issues.

    1- The prices of the auction house will up rise and will be disgusting just like i have seen in private servers. Basically a Official server with unlimited stamina is similar to a private server. As Closers isn't designed to have unlimited stamina. Just like in VoidEls. You may not know this game . But it has disgusting prices. Cause bots can basically run dungeons and Secret Dungeons endlessly.

    2- People will get gear and cap within a couple of days after the official launch. Making the game extremely boring as their is not much to do after cap since this is not KR. This is just NA which we wont even have the dungeons and features that KR has Right now. We wont even have Official and Special Agent/Crew.

    3- There is stuff you craft that are very useful in the end game.. Basically if you have unlimited stamina. You can basically farm the items non stop and get them. Those are drop able in normal dungeons and their are a lot of stuff you get that do help in the end game phase.

    4- Hackers will benefit from the unlimited stamina. Which also up rises the prices in the auction house.

    Once again Unlimited stamina is nice. But it has a sacrifice. But The consequences are serious and can't be reverted quite well. That's why I strongly disagree and I encourage En masse to not remove the fatigue system instead i suggest them focus on the Fatigue system greatly.

  • @Rucellex said:

    @Seimore said:
    Honestly, a player ran economy sounds more harmful than unlim stamina does.
    I doubt that'd be removed, but if it were to be, would unlim stamina be a problem then?

    In all seriousness, bots can't be a problem if there is no economy to ruin. I don't know how this game works or if people sell items from the Cash Shop in game and stuff, but, how would that change the game? Veering a bit off topic, but the two ideas seem to be very linked as of now.

    You guys still dont understand. unlimited stamina is bad. It will make the prices horrible. Even if bots dont exist.The prices will still be op. The amount of Credit that bots will get from farming and the auction house will be pretty a mess. So i think to avoid that is just have stamina. Alot of people do want stamina. Because the consequences are pretty much cant be reverted. I mean i do like unlimited stamina. Trust me . But there will be a sacrfice if we get unlimited stamina. Which are worst than having Limited stamina.

    I want you to reread what I was saying.
    I'm not talking about addressing stamina first, but a player economy. Prices wouldn't be OP if people can't trade. What benefits does the economy, as a whole, give? I'm curious, only played in KR so I never really touched the economy.

  • @Seimore said:

    @Rucellex said:

    @Seimore said:
    Honestly, a player ran economy sounds more harmful than unlim stamina does.
    I doubt that'd be removed, but if it were to be, would unlim stamina be a problem then?

    In all seriousness, bots can't be a problem if there is no economy to ruin. I don't know how this game works or if people sell items from the Cash Shop in game and stuff, but, how would that change the game? Veering a bit off topic, but the two ideas seem to be very linked as of now.

    You guys still dont understand. unlimited stamina is bad. It will make the prices horrible. Even if bots dont exist.The prices will still be op. The amount of Credit that bots will get from farming and the auction house will be pretty a mess. So i think to avoid that is just have stamina. Alot of people do want stamina. Because the consequences are pretty much cant be reverted. I mean i do like unlimited stamina. Trust me . But there will be a sacrfice if we get unlimited stamina. Which are worst than having Limited stamina.

    I want you to reread what I was saying.
    I'm not talking about addressing stamina first, but a player economy. Prices wouldn't be OP if people can't trade. What benefits does the economy, as a whole, give? I'm curious, only played in KR so I never really touched the economy.

    Yes thats what im saying. There is stuff to ruin the economy and yes Unlim stam is problem as well. People think if they make all items account bound it wont ruin the economy. I think you can still seal them and make them tradable once again. And its not just that Money or Credits will also be farmed like crazy with unlimited stamina. So yea bots are issue. And they can ruin the economy if we let it. If we have a stamina system then it should balance out stuff. So even account bound items wont really help that much. As you need to seal and sell stuff in the auction.

  • @Rucellex said:

    @ActuallyEndgame said:

    @Rucellex said:
    Again Unlimited stamina is very unlikely as the KR version has Stamina

    Nope. Removing Stamina from NA versions of kMMOs is the norm.

    Honestly, Vindictus destroys most of these pro-Stamina arguments. NA released with the token system. Nexon NA gave us unlimited tokens "for a month". Then they flat out removed the token system.

    .....And none of the things the pro-Stamina say would happen happened. In part because everything valuable comes from raids/Hero stages that are too hard for bots to farm. (In Closers, all the stuff you WOULD want to buy from the Black Market besides costumes and accessories are bound to character. No buying purple hexagons or goblets, you gotta grind for them yourself. You can't even bank share them to your other characters.)

    Again your info is non-sense and completely irrelevant. Those are 2 different games. Closers is not designed to have unlimited stamina . Seriously.. Its like your playing Closers ( Private server) .

    Nope. I'm playing KR.

    So believe me when I say the following things:

    -Everything that can be farmed in normal stages (rainbow dust, dimensional essences, DNA, etc.) can be obtained in greater quantities in stages with daily limits. And there really isn't any real need to ever buy them from the black market.

    -All the materials from endgame stages that are necessary for endgame gear are bound to character and cannot be sold. (Or even shared between other characters in the same account.)

    -The only truly valuable things that can be gotten from normal stages are the wings dropped by Irina and Camilla. And some Area 7 accessories. (Since it's the only set that can be used with Splendor of Darkness and Cybernetic due to slots.) And even then, raid bosses drop their own wings too. (Gremory has a rainbow aura that occupies the same slot.) Probably at higher drop rates. UNION Camp also lets you craft wings that takes about 90 days and 90 million credits. (Only once per account. Wings are bound to character.)

    -Nearly every daily limit stage, including training programs from Area 5 onwards and outdated Plane Gate stages, yields more credits per run than a normal stage. (And some don't even have credit rewards for stage clear. You get the credits from coins/statues instead.)

    There is nothing unlimited stamina can do to ruin the economy since everything good is obtained through daily limit stages. Seriously. I can't stress this enough. Just the wings. And those things have low extremely low drop rates. (I had to shell out 450 million credits to get my Levia's wings.) Probably lower drop rates in the stages than they do in the Area 5 and 7 training programs.

    If some no lifer really wants to spend his days running 8-7 (Or 8.5-3?) hundreds of times after he's gone through ALL the daily limit stages (There's a lot to go through.) for some extra cash, more power to him. But he's not going to rule the economy unless he buys up cash shop items and sells them..... pay2win is the true way to destroy the economy. Not botting. Just ask OneLastDance about it. He's the one who brought NA Elsword and DFO to their knees by throwing enough money at the game to amass large quantities of ingame currency to buy up everything of value and mark up the prices..... Stamina won't do ANYTHING to prevent that from happening here.

  • ZeonslitZeonslit Member
    edited August 2017

    @ActuallyEndgame
    What's the fuss with those wings? Are they pure aesthetic(with small stat boosts) or they provide some serious movement speed/etc bonuses? Or they are a part of "namehere" set?
    I don't think that 450 mil is a small price.

    p.s. I guess if someone will spent thousands of $ on Closers, this will make Enmasse only happier.

  • @MicheleSP said:
    Let's say it in short...

    I rather like having stamina system with good EXP and drops, rather than unlimited stamina with shitty EXP and grinding for items.

    I support this in 100%

  • @Zeonslit said:
    @ActuallyEndgame
    What's the fuss with those wings? Are they pure aesthetic(with small stat boosts) or they provide some serious movement speed/etc bonuses? Or they are a part of "namehere" set?
    I don't think that 450 mil is a small price.

    p.s. I guess if someone will spent thousands of $ on Closers, this will make Enmasse only happier.

    Wings are the rarest thing in this game iirc, its like a 1-3% drop of getting a wing from dung drop there is another wing thats through gacha(cashing) not sure if the gacha one can be put up in BM as of late, 500m can be a small price if you do all ur dailies correctly, tho imo wings are just only for looks / extra stats nothing less.

  • @Zeonslit said:
    @ActuallyEndgame
    What's the fuss with those wings? Are they pure aesthetic(with small stat boosts) or they provide some serious movement speed/etc bonuses? Or they are a part of "namehere" set?
    I don't think that 450 mil is a small price.

    p.s. I guess if someone will spent thousands of $ on Closers, this will make Enmasse only happier.

    In addition to the aesthetic purposes, wings have all stats in their tuning option pool. Meaning they are a potential source for boosting Attack and Critical Hit Damage (Physical/Magic or situational.), and can give +1 to Finishing Move skill levels.

    So basically they're really cool looking and have the potential for significant stat boosts.

  • @ActuallyEndgame
    If you put it that way, then i guess Stamina is not a problem.
    This means Closers endgame is pretty much the same as Dragon Nest. Dragon Nest raid dungeons could be cleared around 4-6-8 times per week with 1-2 bonus runs with special rare tokens(or around that, maybe +/- 1). Clearing those each week without OP/over-enchanted/etc gear is not fast process (and for some players - not easy either), so i never had Stamina problems in Dragon Nest.
    Well, i wonder what they will decide in the end, doubt that discussion between 10 users will affect final decision in the end. -cough-

    p.s. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Closers patchnotes:

    • Infinity Stamina implemented
    • Daily dungeon limit entry nerfed from 3 to 1 to balance the changes.
      ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
  • PhoenixShiPhoenixShi Member
    edited August 2017

    @MicheleSP said:
    Let's say it in short...

    I rather like having stamina system with good EXP and drops, rather than unlimited stamina with shitty EXP and grinding for items.

    Which is exactly the kind of things that happen when games with a stamina system, tinker with it. Stamina, and grind are used to extend how long a player will be playing the game, as in online games devs, and publishers want you to keep playing, and coming back day, after day, which is why there tends to be so many daily log in rewards, events, and tasks in online games of all types. Online games on a whole should be approached as a marathon, not a sprint, you just shouldn't expect anything to be done quickly, as they are by design always done to prolong the playing experience in one way, or another. Stamina systems also are used in how they expect to make money, if they change the stamina system, you can expect them to change how they try to make money as well. The whole notion that it relates just to some laws in another country is flat out false.

    Something like a stamina system, or hard limits on how many times a given content can be done over a period of time extend things by limiting the content you can do with a given character, while grind limits the rewards, so you have to keep playing longer hours, to achieve the same results. Grind heavy games tend to be ones where vets tell new players to pick one character, and stick with it, as if they try to play multiple chars, they won't be able to devote enough time to any of them to get very far. In games like this, which instead limit the content you do, they also tend to enforce playing multiple characters, not just one as the most optimal way to play. There will be rewards, and/or bonus systems in the game that will be best, or even only achievable by playing multiple characters, while by limiting how much you can play with any one character, they're using negative reinforcement to get people to play multiple characters, which is the carrot, and stick method of getting animals/people to do what you want.

    The people that have a problem with stamina systems, are those that just want to play one character, although for someone like me, who wants to play multiple characters, a stamina system is not a problem at all, and these games make my preferred way of play far more functional than in games that just use grind. The stamina system, and related involves a lot of aspects of how the game works, and how they make money from the game, it can't just be easily removed. If you want to play just one character, go play a game that is designed to be played with just one character. Trying to demand they change a game like this which is designed to be played using multiple characters, so you can play it only using one, is like if you only wanted to play brawlers, so went into a FPS game forums, and demanded the publisher/dev change the game to allow you to play it as a brawler. Different games, are meant to appeal to different audiences, figure out what you want, then find games that try to provide you with that experience, don't go into games expecting them to gut important aspects just to appease your own selfish desires.

  • NeoyoshiNeoyoshi Member
    edited September 2017

    If EME treats it like how Stamina works in our version of Kritika, then that would be good news indeed.

    From my general understand, the harsher versions of Daily Stamina we used to see back in the previous decade (the stamina that limited game-play altogether) no longer exists in the Western markets, and if they do, they are found in super obscure titles.

    However the way Stamina has been utilized lately as a tool to curve and slow down progression and drop-rates per day has been the right choice the whole time, and i hope it stays that way, because the current method plays a part in partially controlling a game worlds economy from growing too quickly.

  • Either way is fine. But, unlimited stamina is much more comfy for me. (Been on other servers). I doubt PG/Tiamat (endgame dungeons) drop rates will be nerf since they have entry limits.

    Imo I believe limited stamina will be an unnecessary obstacle if all of your characters are farming on PG/Tiamat.

  • i dislike stamina systems mostly do to the fact me and my friends dont play on the same time schedule and there have been ample of times in games where stamina limits gameplay iv used up my stamina when my friend shows up and wants to play. i dont know how farming is an issue when in games most of the time a players goals is to improve or get a rare drop which promotes the need for farming which is my fav aspect of a game to try and get a rare drop for my character. isn't that kinda the point of games to begin with in that case what really is the point in having a stamina system that limits game-play. so i vouch for complete remove of the stamina system or if one must be in place, to only have it decrease exp or drop rates by a certain amount not to the point where a player feels like no progression is being made. i personally arnt not a fan of pvp my playstyle is more pve and i think its best not to limit how many times a person can run a dungeon. just my input

  • personally dont mind stamina,will let me balance between soul worker and kritika

  • Stamina became poitless when they add the house system because every level you get 100 more stamina and since the max level is 15 you get 1500 more stamina per acc so its pointless now.

    Besides Krikita online have that RP thing so 100% Closers will be the same.

  • Uhh, is that in JP?

    Because I have a level 15 Union Camp in KR and my Stamina is the same.

    They did however increase account Stamina after releasing Tina, I think. Having a certain amount of characters raises it. But individual character Stamina remains the same.

  • ZeonslitZeonslit Member
    edited September 2017

    After testing things in Kritika (EU), i'd like a similar "unlimited Stamina system" implemented for Closers.

  • I'm okay with stamina systems as long as there are free stamina weekends so you can play all weekend without having to worry about losing all stamina and not being able to play anymore on a certain character.

  • What we know is , good MMOs, who granted themselves with the population of the greatest loyalty, granted themselves with the game manias, who would spent GREAT amount of time farming and researching the game, that would cost them DAYS on a Single Character, like PSO2 and Maplestory, what they do to prevent too much equipment drop is limiting how many times you could enter the boss dungeons, like what CLO has done for now, even in the very game we have to farm exp for all characters to get team support buffs from them with an at least level 20 progress, you still have to "Main" someone, isn`t it?
    So we could grant us with Unlimited stamina, but in a alternated way: take those stamina recovering drinks in to the credit shops, with a reasonable price, then the players would enjoy their character as they want, while Enmasse coul recycle lots of credits from it.

  • Well considering someone has bumped it already...

    The amount of stamina we have now with the +100 is fairly comfortable. maybe throw in an earnable 30 stam pot for a day. I was pretty leery about stamina and this game but. After playing with it abit. The amount we have currently is fairly good considering the drop rates. But 170 stamina per character would be far too little. (Imo anyways)

  • Why would unlimited stamina be good for bots, they can just make more accounts and more characters?
    Is it so daft to expect the developers to handle bots to even the slightest degree? I understand it may be unrealistic but you have to remember that EME has a hard IP lock on Asia and Africa regions which is where many of those bottling rigs are located.
    If anything, it would help normal players since they could grind every day on their max level character longer while the bot gets banned constantly and has to start from level 1... Assuming the host isn't utterly hopeless.

    Why would you need to lower drop/EXP rates to compensate for stamina? That makes literally no sense.

  • Tbh,i think limited stamina on week days and unlimited(or more stam) on week-ends would be best.

  • MinosaurMinosaur Member
    edited September 2017

    @Kuuris said:
    Tbh,i think limited stamina on week days and unlimited(or more stam) on week-ends would be best.

    "screw everyone who does not have traditional weekends, The stamina system is fine as long as I don't encounter it."

    Can we please just agree it needs to be removed.

  • I made a pretty detailed post about my view on things and it got removed for no reason, how sad..

  • @Mystio said:
    I made a pretty detailed post about my view on things and it got removed for no reason, how sad..

    I got you, I saw the post and it was completely harmless so I'm asking around what the deal with that is. It's not the first time messages have mysteriously disappeared on these forums haha.

  • edited September 2017

    @Minosaur said:

    @Kuuris said:
    Tbh,i think limited stamina on week days and unlimited(or more stam) on week-ends would be best.

    "screw everyone who does not have traditional weekends, The stamina system is fine as long as I don't encounter it."

    Can we please just agree it needs to be removed.

    Yeah, people calling for unlimited Stamina weekends really need to realize that not everybody gets the weekend off.

    If my days off were, say, Tuesday and Thursday and I want to hardcore grind but everyone else gets that option, well..... that'd make me consider playing another game.

    But no Stamina gives everyone an equal opportunity.

  • Stamina system is fine as it is, nuff said.

  • @Synalra said:
    Stamina system is fine as it is, nuff said.

    No. "nuff said." does not make you correct.

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