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Awakening Patch, Class Balance, Talents and You.

With the Class Awakening patch in the horizon, on futures update in development road map, we will start seeing some issues with class balance.
This will happen because despite BHS saying they don't balances classes with talents in mind they actually do: look the current changes slayers got in NA and talent changes on Ninja in ktera.
The reason they cant balance without talents in mind is because some classes would be broken in ktera, and they cant allow that to happen.

What i proposing here is that other classes also get the same buff as slayer got on this patch for regions other than ktera : transform the talents in passives that everyone can get. But you cant transform all talents from all classes in passives, because you get the risk the opposite of class balances.

In order to avoid that is necessary choose the most essential talents for each class in a certain amount of points. Current top korean players have around 300-400 points to spend, that is after almost 2 years of constant farming. (the grind for 400pts is bigger than farming tera rewards exp for tier 10).

Another important aspect is avoid talents that direct affect the pvp scene.

So with that in mind i am proposing that the following talents become available as passive when the class awakening patch comes.

ALL CLASSES - points included on classes breakdown
  • Increase power by 23 - 80 points
  • Increase Endurance by 23 - 70 points

WARRIOR - total : 330 points
  • Charging Slash / 20% Chance to reset cooldown of this skill when hitting an enemy after Charging Slash - 30 points;
  • Deadly Gamble / For 10 seconds, increases power by 10, further increased by 1 with 30% chance up to 24 with every hit - 80 points;
  • Deadly Gamble / Prolongs the above effect by 10 seconds - 70 points;

LANCER - total: 329 points
  • Adrenaline Rush / Increases duration of adrenaline Rush by 5second - 29 points;
  • Adrenaline Rush / For 10 seconds, increases power by 10, further increased by 1 with 30% chance up to 24 with every hit - 80 points;
  • Adrenaline Rush / Prolongs the above effect by 10 seconds - 70 points;

SLAYER - total: 335 points
  • In Cold Blood / For 5 seconds, increases power by 10, further increased by 1 with 34% chance up to 24 - 80 points;
  • In Cold Blood / Prolongs the above effect by 1.5 seconds, increases max stack size to 26 - 25 points;
  • Headlong Rush / the next skill used gains an additional 11% casting speed increase - 30 points;
  • Measured Slice / Recovers 575 MP on every crit with this skill - 50 points;

BERSERKER - total: 340 points
  • Thunder Strike / Increases Charging Speed during Fiery Rage - 30 points;
  • Thunder Strike / Increases Movespeed while using this skill - 55 points;
  • Cyclone / Increases Movespeed while using this skill - 30 points;
  • Evasive Smash / 20% Chance to reset this skills Cooldown - 45 points;
  • Lethal Strike / Increases Charging Speed during Fiery Rage - 30 points;

SORCERER - total: 340 points
  • Mana Boost / Increases Damage dealt by 11.5% during Mana Boost - 55 points;
  • Lightning Strike / When [Lighning Strike] Crit, reduce cooldown of [Nova] by 1 second - 60 points;
  • Hailstorm / When [Frost Sphere] and [Glacial Retreat] crit, reduce cooldown of [Hailstorm] by 1.7s - 45 points;
  • Nova / Increases this skills casting speed by 15% - 30 points;

ARCHER - total: 315 points
  • Radiant Arrow / 15% Chance to reset this skills cooldown and increases Charging speed by 28% if used again - 30 points;
  • Rain of Arrows / Increases casting speed of this skill by 15% - 30 points;
  • Feign Death / This skill is an i frame during 3.5seconds - 30 points;
  • Rapid Fire / 9% Chance to increase crit rate by 7 on hit, stacks up to 4 times, lasts 3 seconds - 30 points;
  • Thunderbolt / Reduces Cooldown of this skill per target hit by 2.7seconds - 45 points;

PRIEST - total: 316 points
  • Resurrect / Increases casting speed by 25% - 30 points;
  • Mana Charge / 25% Chance to give your allies a buff that regens 80 MP/s for 8 seconds - 30 points;
  • Tripple Nemesis / Decreases Target crit resistance by 12 when all 3 hits land - 22 points;
  • Isharas Lullably / 20% Chance to reset cooldown of skill upon hit - 42 points;
  • Backstep / Increases your Movespeed by 35 after use - 42 points;

MYSTIC - total 319 points
  • Vow of Rebirth / 20% Chance to reset this skills Cooldown when someone is resurrected - 45 points;
  • Teleport Jaunt / Increases your Movement speed by 35 after use for 3 seconds - 42 points;
  • Metamorphic Smite / 25% Chance to reset Cooldown of Metamorphic Blast on hit, increasing it's damage by 20% - 30 points;
  • Metamorphic Smite / Increases Casting speed of this skill - 30 points;
  • Volley of Curses / Decreases Target crit resistance by 12 - 22 points;

REAPER- total: 330 points
  • Sundering Strike / Increases the casting speed of this skill by 25% - 30 points;
  • Shadow Reaping / For 10 seconds, increases power by 10, further increased by 1 with 30% chance up to 24 - 80 points;
  • Shadow Reaping / Prolongs the above effect by 10 seconds - 70 points;

GUNNER - total: 357 points
  • Scattershot / 10% Chance to reset Cooldown of [Replenish] on hit - 45 points;
  • Burst Fire / 26% Chance to increase Power by 1 per hit, up to 24 - 88 points;
  • Burst Fire / Prolongs the above effect by 9 seconds - 74 points;

BRAWLER - total: 330 points
  • Punch / Reduces Cooldown of [Roundhouse Kick], [Jackhammer], [Piledriver] and [Haymaker] on crit - 45 points;
  • Haymaker / Decreases Cooldown by 3seconds on crit - 45 points;
  • Roundhouse Kick / 10% Chance to reset this skills cooldown - 45 points;
  • Counterpunch / 6% Chance upon Perfect Block to receive 100% Crit Chance for 5 seconds - 45 points;

NINJA- total: 334 points
  • Double Cut / 50% Chance upon crit, gain 1 Power for 5 seconds up to 24 Power - 88 points;
  • Double Cut / Prolongs above effect by 8 seconds - 74 points;
  • Burning Heat / Decreases cooldown of [Attunement] by 4.5s per hit - 22 points;

VALKYRIE- total: 317 points
  • Charge / 20% chance to reset this skills cooldown on hit - 30 points;
  • Spinning Death / Increases your Crit Factor by 20 for 3 seconds when all 3 hits land - 45 points;
  • Bloodflower / Increases your Crit Power by 1.12 - 63 points;
  • Balders Tears / Increases duration of the skill by 5s- 29 points;


Keep in mind that this is just a suggestion to be pushed to BHS in order to equalize the regions balances regarding PVE, since we know that is possible to add them as passive. And make all future balance patches easier to compare between ktera and other regions.

If necessary i can provide this list in korean
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Comments

  • TaldekTaldek ✭✭
    edited February 4
    Posting source so people dont think hes pulling these buffs out of thin air, this is a list of every single talent in ktera for every class:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-bFS8xWFvK3cdDsGGBnjelHj5Jvb3xNhebeOthjj27k/edit#gid=1912635731

    The ones posted are the green and blue highlighted ones which are the real game changers.
  • SeikilosSeikilos ✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    i don't see void pulse reset on sorc and from what i ve heard it is a big deal, as it contributes enough to the overal dps.

    but that 's the problem. there are some propositions and then people will start to ask for this or that talent to be added for w/e reason.

    point is that this system has to come to western Tera. but bhs won't listen no matter what. and i don't think publishers can or care enough to push.

    we literally play 2 different games at this point. ktera is one and other regions is the other.

    i don't want to burst any bubbles but unless you get any official answer from a stuff member w/e we say here is like it was never said.
  • counterpointcounterpoint ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    Just as an FYI, myself and many other people on Player Council have also (repeatedly) provided the same/similar feedback that BHS needs to implement the essential balance-impacting talents as passives in our region. The breakdown of exactly what to add is very useful, but I hope BHS finally agrees to action the concern at all. The concern has definitely been raised up the chain many times before, but hopefully nth time the charm...
  • KetothKetoth ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    Seikilos wrote: »
    i don't see void pulse reset on sorc and from what i ve heard it is a big deal, as it contributes enough to the overal dps.

    but that 's the problem. there are some propositions and then people will start to ask for this or that talent to be added for w/e reason.

    point is that this system has to come to western Tera. but bhs won't listen no matter what. and i don't think publishers can or care enough to push.

    we literally play 2 different games at this point. ktera is one and other regions is the other.

    i don't want to burst any bubbles but unless you get any official answer from a stuff member w/e we say here is like it was never said.

    void pulse was removed because otherwise the total points for sorc would be too high compared to other classes
    reliability > chance on this case. so void pulse had to drop out (was only 15% reset chance) otherwise would be nova cast speed, lots of simulations were made in order to decide, they are really close in term of dps gain

    you may argue that gunner have a lot of points, but that the scattershot doesnt do too much than maybe increase the willpower generation
  • SeikilosSeikilos ✭✭✭
    that is...something. but bhs hasn;t budge a bit on this matter. i know i shouldn't see the glass half empty, but we really have nothing on our hands other than "hope".

    so...

    but to be honest, the reason i'm so pesimistic is because the system is already in the game code for western tera but it isn't turned on. which makes me think they have some very specific reason to not let it on, other than "it's buggy". but since bhs isn't openly speaking, not even to the korean community*, i think we will never know the actual reason and thus if our pledge is rightful or if we are just hitting our heads on the wall. which is insane because if we knew it was in vain we could find some other solution. but since we are in the dark, we just keep asking and asking and asking....



    *we ve seen many times when loriri brings over their letters or interviews, that they give vague and generalised answers to many serious questions to the point it's not worth translating.
  • KetothKetoth ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    Just as an FYI, myself and many other people on Player Council have also (repeatedly) provided the same/similar feedback that BHS needs to implement the essential balance-impacting talents as passives in our region. The breakdown of exactly what to add is very useful, but I hope BHS finally agrees to action the concern at all. The concern has definitely been raised up the chain many times before, but hopefully nth time the charm...

    I know that talents are class balances regarding talents was send to BHS multiple times, @Idi0ticGenius even help me with the translation of some talents in the begining. The point is : None had the trouble to breakdown every single class and which speciifc talent is necessary in order to balance. every single thread about talent is : we need talents / its too buggy / grindy / give us talents / random talent mention / give us talent now.
    how do you expect bhs answer a feedback like that? so the point of this thread is list the talents that are essential to aproximate the PvE balance close to ktera Balance. why now: because people can see that this possible ( slayer changes), since not too many people know all the talents for each class or don't bother checking future ktera patches. And the awakening patch is around the corner, 3months +, giving enough time for bhs devs to add this.

    the slayer changes are even from PLAYER FEEDBACK on ktera that said slayer had too many good talents and was impossible get all in reasonable time
  • clfarron4clfarron4 ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 4
    In a sentence: I'm surprised they haven't turned the Talent System on for other regions to reduce the amount of stuff they have to think about, giving them more time to do other things.

    ====

    Whilst I believe that the best solution the disparity caused by the Talent System is for BHS to tell all regions to turn it on, I would support Ketoth's proposal as an alternative as it captures the main parts of the Talent System that would probably be suggested to be used in class guides if they were written for the Talent System.

    The bonus for BHS if they were to enable the Talent System across all regions is that they would be bringing all the builds outside of KTERA in-line with the KTERA build, efffectively equalising a significant part of the core build across all the regions. This is good because it means they don't have to cater to two core builds. Yes, there would be the issue in that KTERA would be getting on towards 3 years of grind of Talent System levels ahead of everyone else, but that should correct itself over time by people playing the game.
  • Ketoth, you are one of the most respected persons in the community, and everyone who even cares about the game knows about your amazing work for Tera Theory crafting.
    Having said that, we all know that if BHS really wanted to help other regions, theres a [filtered] ton of stuff they could do. How long since the Talents patch should have hit Na? Even now, What they did with Slayer and ninja was BC of ktera ppl complaining, not because other regions.
    In an ideal world, this would ve a gift for the devs, but here it's just "oh look another qq post from NA lul".
    Good luck with this.
  • DvsvDvsv ✭✭✭✭
    edited February 5
    No wonder why we need to slay on rke.
    Every class on NA is weak af if we compare to korea.
    I wonder when end-game content becomes unplayable on NA if they continue balancing dungeons arround OP talents..
  • PoniloverPonilover ✭✭✭
    i like how u ppl still think we're getting awakening
    cuz we won't
    at most we'll get changes to the existing skills like new glyphs and skill chains for lancers
  • ArdireArdire ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ponilover wrote: »
    i like how u ppl still think we're getting awakening
    cuz we won't
    at most we'll get changes to the existing skills like new glyphs and skill chains for lancers

    interesting take. you wanna elaborate?

    the community is already aware we're basically playing two entirely different games with the lack of the talent system so to not bring over awakening to NA would be a pretty cruel and blatantly rude nail in the coffin imo
  • FRSTYFRSTY ✭✭
    I think everything should cost the same for all classes, unless there's a specific reason as to why it costs more for one class compared to another.
  • PoniloverPonilover ✭✭✭
    As if forcing everyone to play awakened classes only isn't as nail-in-the-coffin-ish.
    Either we get the castrated version of the awakening, or we don't get it at all.

    Personally, i'd rather we don't get the awakening at all, fixing the existing balance problems would be enough.

  • canikizucanikizu ✭✭✭
    Ardire wrote: »
    Ponilover wrote: »
    i like how u ppl still think we're getting awakening
    cuz we won't
    at most we'll get changes to the existing skills like new glyphs and skill chains for lancers

    interesting take. you wanna elaborate?

    the community is already aware we're basically playing two entirely different games with the lack of the talent system so to not bring over awakening to NA would be a pretty cruel and blatantly rude nail in the coffin imo

    Because NA isn't the only region that don't have talents. EU, RU, JP, TW, CH and Thailand don't have it too, yet they don't complain as much as us. NA isn't favorite child, not by a long shot. Unless all other regions also voice their concerns at the same time, this post will go nowhere.
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