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Priest hit by MASSIVE NERF with Godsfall update

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Comments

  • SaphirKanzakiSaphirKanzaki ✭✭✭✭
    Wow, think before posting.

    Before Godsfall, one focus heal would fill up half to 2/3 of another player's HP.

    Be honest: Did you manage to support slaying mode? No, because we healed way too much.
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 2018
    flarecde wrote: »
    Nopi wrote: »
    I want to know more about this. Have you been to starter dungeon parties with non apex healers? Are people dying now in these dungeons? or are they still considered easy even for a full newbie?
    I am a non-apex healer. I wouldn't consider myself a full newbie, I've done all the earlier dungeons a lot as DPS (gunner and berserker), I only started playing my priest after the patch. Twistshard +0 gear. I've done both T1 and T2 dungeons. With my guild it's not terrible, but occasionally people die, especially if they're spread out and face tanking mechanics. PUGs can be a real horror show though, due to the significantly reduced coordination and communication.

    I like the significantly reduced dependency on focus heal, previously the priest was boring. But I feel that without the awakened skills, I'm missing some tools. I can only imagine for a true fresh 65 it's even rougher. DPS are going to have to learn how to play a bit more conservatively in the easier dungeons, but try explaining that to a full SC +9 vet who's used to facerolling everything and view earlier dungeons only as quick money and not a training experience for less skilled players.

    If that's the tale on non awakened, then newbie healers are in for a harsh lesson. Though your tale doesn't look like it's made completely unplayable, but the nerf pretty much drove the difficulty up for newbies in starter dungeons, and could slow them down a bit for veterans (but not by much), like a slap with a reality check. Then again, how many real newbies would Tera PC have as of now?

    I don't see a problem with trying to make the classes more technical and a bit harder to use if they were deemed too easy, though. Now let's see about making Ninja much harder to play as well...
  • Zenjion wrote: »
    Then again, how many real newbies would Tera PC have as of now?

    Well while running lowbie dungeons for fun I can say there are definitely at least enough new healers that I can imagine some wiping in KDNM or TRNM without any sort of carry since after the patch, at least in IMS.

    As it stands the introduction to healing at 65 is a really harsh wall rather than a learning curve because healers get mechanics thrown their way, some of which they need to handle in a certain way, need to cleanse relatively often, debuff the boss, buff party members and of course, heal people.
    Short of the last 3 things there most of those are almost non-existent pre-65 or at the least the frequency on healer-focused mechanics, cleanse-able debuffs and such ramp up by a lot when you hit 65.

    Combine that with healer nerfs I can see new 65 healers struggling a bit. But of course there's not much that can be done outside of lowering the damage dealt in those dungeons which would make them a cake-walk for anyone the least bit experienced with the game and promote face-tanking.
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    But of course there's not much that can be done outside of lowering the damage dealt in those dungeons which would make them a cake-walk for anyone the least bit experienced with the game and promote face-tanking.
    Agreed. I feel this patch has some loose ends that could be fixed in terms of entry level for new healers. Once they know what to do, the game does become more fun. This is more of a learning hairpin than a learning curve for many, mostly those who have a healer as their first/only experience in the game. I feel this should be addressed, since we don't want the community to suffer from a lack of healers in end game due to people quitting and adding themselves to the already massive DPS fold, or, quitting altogether in frustration...
  • Am I alone in thinking that being a healer in this game isn't that friggin complicated?

    Maybe my experience isn't the best to gauge things by since I've been playing off and on since open beta, but I've never found priest (my healing class of choice and second character I've ever made) that particularly complicated. I find priest to be just like any other class in this game, in that you just take the time to read through your skills, know what they do and which are most useful, and find a way to rotate the skills efficiently.

    JUST LIKE ANY OTHER CLASS IN THE GAME.

    People having a hard time learning to heal properly likely wouldn't be good at any other class anyways, so let's not sit here and pretend that healing is any more complicated than it really is. It only took a couple dungeon runs to figure out the new rotation with Apex skills, which make priest INFINITELY more useful.

    (Because let's face it, you never needed to be able to heal more than 2/3rds of a party member's health with your basic healing skill)
  • Healing is significantly more complicated than DPS, mainly because your performance always hinges on the performance of the rest of your group. Playing a healer is trivial if your group is good and dodges everything, and quite strenuous if your group decides that their faces need a good dose of damage. Whereas a DPS needs to focus on a single target, the boss, a healer needs to track both that same target and four others. Plus manage their own health. And buff. And debuff. And dispel. And maybe do some damage too.

    As a DPS, if you need to focus on a mechanic you can stop and focus on it, since most TERA bosses (particularly the early ones) do not have timers. A healer can't stop working, because then people might die.

    With less focus on, well, focus heal, this makes it all the more challenging. Whereas focus heal is just target and forget, the rest of the heals are far more positional and situational. Most of them have very narrow fields of effect, which makes healing against large bosses or with scatter party members difficult.
  • MajesticPeterMajesticPeter ✭✭
    edited April 2018
    Actually Priests are IMO the most complicated class to play because you need to keybind every single skill and there are a lot of them. They also have a lot more work to do than any other class. Heal, buff, debuff, watch for mechanics, and now even pull people out of danger. While DPS and tank just need to focus on the boss and mechanics.

    I've read some people talk about Divine Charge now having a heal. Yes, a very powerful heal infact, however it carries a HUGE risk. The charge tick AoE is very small and you need to hug your party, aka hugging the boss just to heal people. Also the 50% range glyph doesn't seem to work at this time. Things get even more "fun" with Divine Charge because in order for the power+mana+heal to even affect your party, they need to get touched by EACH charge tick. Each tick increases effectiveness up to whatever glyphs you use. The final release does nothing and the AoE on the final release is misleading. So you HAVE to stand next to the boss for 2sec to charge it. This makes Divine Charge a very complicated skill to use.

    Focus Heal is now useless and needs to be used in conjunction with other skills like Holy Burst for example and that's if your Priest is even awakened yet. Most bosses in end-game will chip away half your health with standard attacks while the failed mechanics will cause a 90% health loss or instant-kill. AFAIK those are armor ignoring so whatever damage reduction you get from skills now, won't mitigate this damage. Only Kaia's Shield can mitigate it. This was never an issue to heal before because Focus Heal was so strong, now it could cause things to get bad. Healing Circle used to be near spammable, but now it has almost the same cooldown as Restorative Burst.

    Regeneration Circle won't help much if your party is taking heavy damage.

    This is why I'm saying that party coordination is going to be more important than ever now. I'm already being yelled at by people who don't understand mechanics and stand inside of ground effects. Certain bosses right now have either been buffed or are bugged as well. Kalivan's Challenge/Dreadnaught for example, the 2nd boss creates a ground effect in a straight line that now does (if I remember correct) 60k damage per tick while previously it only did 10k damage. I've even seen him double-cast it, causing the affected party members to die instantly.

    I don't understand why BHS made Divine Intervention a party pull skill. It's almost as if Priests are now meant to babysit the whole party? It's not always an option to pull people out of AoE's because most of the time, I'll be standing in range anyway since most heals are near melee range.
  • flarecde wrote: »
    Healing is significantly more complicated than DPS, mainly because your performance always hinges on the performance of the rest of your group. Playing a healer is trivial if your group is good and dodges everything, and quite strenuous if your group decides that their faces need a good dose of damage. Whereas a DPS needs to focus on a single target, the boss, a healer needs to track both that same target and four others. Plus manage their own health. And buff. And debuff. And dispel. And maybe do some damage too.

    As a DPS, if you need to focus on a mechanic you can stop and focus on it, since most TERA bosses (particularly the early ones) do not have timers. A healer can't stop working, because then people might die.

    With less focus on, well, focus heal, this makes it all the more challenging. Whereas focus heal is just target and forget, the rest of the heals are far more positional and situational. Most of them have very narrow fields of effect, which makes healing against large bosses or with scatter party members difficult.

    Couldn't have said it better myself. +1
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    Am I alone in thinking that being a healer in this game isn't that friggin complicated?
    May not be that complicated, but do note that the healer meta just changed. Gotta give people time to adapt. There's also the problem with those healers that just got nerfed with no buffs at all. I refer to those in the current hole that is being between i-levels 426 to 438.

  • I find priests easier than mystics. But I love playing mystic.
  • EllexemEllexem ✭✭✭
    Nopi wrote: »
    There's also the problem with those healers that just got nerfed with no buffs at all. I refer to those in the current hole that is being between i-levels 426 to 438.

    Why limit it to just that range? By that point at least you have all of the basic tools to work around the Focus Heal nerf. It might not be fun, it might be more work, but you can work around it if you actually use more of your kit than just Focus Heal.

    The Focus Heal nerf is universal though, and Regeneration Circle can't make up for idiots that only upgrade their weapon, can't be bothered to keep full crystals (or even up to date/correct ones) or getting new gear as quickly as they can while leveling. Undergeared people in dungeons will easily take hits for half of their health. They'll then compound that by face tanking everything. And the leveling Priest won't have all of the tools to actually do something about that.

    You don't get Healing Circle until level 26, so have fun with BoL with Focus Heal and Regeneration Circle. Kaia's Shield is level 42, so that's another 3 dungeons to struggle through, this time with lots of in-close work in places that love to have AE attacks, jumping bosses, and spins. Healing Immersion? 58. Restorative Burst? 61.

    Now, you might consider this change a net positive, something to either weed out the idiots or to get them to improve, because now they can't rely on overpowered healers to do the work for them, but I feel you're ignoring how much of a miserable experience that will be until people adjust.

  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ellexem wrote: »
    Nopi wrote: »
    There's also the problem with those healers that just got nerfed with no buffs at all. I refer to those in the current hole that is being between i-levels 426 to 438.

    Why limit it to just that range? By that point at least you have all of the basic tools to work around the Focus Heal nerf. It might not be fun, it might be more work, but you can work around it if you actually use more of your kit than just Focus Heal.

    The Focus Heal nerf is universal though, and Regeneration Circle can't make up for idiots that only upgrade their weapon, can't be bothered to keep full crystals (or even up to date/correct ones) or getting new gear as quickly as they can while leveling. Undergeared people in dungeons will easily take hits for half of their health. They'll then compound that by face tanking everything. And the leveling Priest won't have all of the tools to actually do something about that.

    You don't get Healing Circle until level 26, so have fun with BoL with Focus Heal and Regeneration Circle. Kaia's Shield is level 42, so that's another 3 dungeons to struggle through, this time with lots of in-close work in places that love to have AE attacks, jumping bosses, and spins. Healing Immersion? 58. Restorative Burst? 61.

    Now, you might consider this change a net positive, something to either weed out the idiots or to get them to improve, because now they can't rely on overpowered healers to do the work for them, but I feel you're ignoring how much of a miserable experience that will be until people adjust.

    Main reason I limit myself to that range is because usually, level up dungeons are run solo by many people, so they won't need heals or a party. If anything, those dungeons become sleep easy in a two man team anyway. And a bunch of other players just skip dungeons and do red quests and bams. So I can assume a healer's level up game didn't change that much. Now, when reaching end game, you get Guardian stuff, IoD and dungeons. if you want to progress quickly, you will be trying all of them. If you are more towards what an MMO is, you will concentrate on dungeons, and that's where you are expected by others to give your best. So until the current community gets used to the healer changes, there may be a few frictions in that range of end game hit hardest. The range that can't use Apex.

    As I said before. it's not impossible, but the bar has raised a bit, and it's ready to weed out the weak.
  • EllexemEllexem ✭✭✭
    Nopi wrote: »
    Main reason I limit myself to that range is because usually, level up dungeons are run solo by many people, so they won't need heals or a party. If anything, those dungeons become sleep easy in a two man team anyway. And a bunch of other players just skip dungeons and do red quests and bams. So I can assume a healer's level up game didn't change that much.

    All leveling dungeons have had the HP of the bosses greatly increased. They are now also largely immune to stun, knockdown and stagger. You need to bring out the big hitters if you want to one-shot them even at level 65, and several will even take that. How is that in any shape or form 'sleep easy'? I mean, if you know how to dodge/block they still won't hurt, but it's not like they actually die in a single rotation or three of DPS skills when you're at the level of them, and they certainly aren't going to be standing still to just take it while you're at it.

    Is your experience just that people will do the trash mobs and then reset, or something like that? Those of course still get mowed down like so much wheat.

    In my experience, the quickest way to level is still dungeons (and Kumas of course, but meh), and not doing them solo, since you both get a 400% bonus to exp for being in a full party as well as that being the best way to actually kill the bosses without needing to whittle away at them for an excessive amount of time. (You're still talking about multiple minutes per boss if the party sucks/is undergeared/is only DPS who can't or won't back crit.) The Vanguard Request for completion also providing quite a big chunk of exp.

    Now, granted, the dungeons haven't gotten really harder, just more tedious and less cheesable. But soloing them is firmly in the realm of the masochist tendencies, in my experience, not the regular approach to doing them. People might still skip them entirely, but that is the slow way to leveling. (And if you are into that then the priest hasn't gotten nerfed, instead having received numerous DPS improvements.) It also doesn't address the situation of those healers who do do them.

    Those who are into the MMO experience might just like to get started on that earlier, so we're right back with them having also been hit by a nerf bat that they need to deal with.
  • aeee98aeee98 ✭✭✭✭
    Despite what people say, healers are really not a difficult role. In fact it is considered to many the laziest role in current endgame due to literally nothing requiring intense heal. After godsfall you have to be less lazy now. If you are perma casting skills 100% of the time prior to godsfall, priest feels hugely buffed even without apex. If you aren't then you have to get in the habit of not being a healbot because that is what I see some healers do.

    People without crystals as an argument is a nonfactor tbh. In NA, crystals are very affordable regardless of what you are spending. As for low ilevels, it is not an excuse to facetank everything to begin with. Apex skills only make it easier once you hit ilevel 439. It isn’t and should never be a requirement for easy dungeons, unless you are impling that prior to godsfall you needed op skills to clear stuff like trnm because otherwise you are too weak to do so.

    Of course there are some problems that arise from Awakening. Brawler tanks who haven’t reached 439 will struggle even harder than ever against people who have their apex skills unlocked (not saying that they aren’t already forced to use a threat when undergeared). Healers will have to get used to using more than one skill to top up party health. Discrimination from elitists has always been there and will continue to be there. However you have to realise that your runs will also improve. As a current priest prior to awakening most of your non direct heal skills are buffed. There is incentive to even dps in more skilled runs. Even as a current dps who is gearing up towards apex, you will realise that runs are faster whenever a fm+ player is around (even non apex classes get decent enough damage boosts to benefit off it).
  • I'm going to bring the topic back to what it was originally about when op started this thread because it seems like it is flying off a tangent.

    I looked at my heal distribution after every boss fight, and its hilarious to see focus heal was never even used, not even once, which makes me consider taking it off the skills tray. Focus heal used to be a bnb for priests, and it is literally your go-to heal, but as of now there is very little use you can make out of a 21k white, or 36k crit.

    Holy burst on the other hand, 53k with a healing over time afterwards is not too bad except for its cooldown. Divine charge also needs very careful timing for example in RKEM you have to wait for animations, so you don't fail to verify and wipe the party if you don't have brooch. Immersion is great and all but if you are caught in a sticky situation and it didn't reset.

    All in all, none of that really matters to me except how useless focus heal is now, that amount of heals doesn't get the job done, in fact it doesn't get any job done.

    Oh yes I heard about you can't use mana charge in FWC now because it is divine charge :)
    gg tera, gg.
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