TERA PC - General Discussion
Suggested Battleground Reward Changes/Reversion
Before I suggest any item changes, I want to first say I agree with Currian’s post. There should be a balance between PVE and PVP rewards, they should vary in their own way and there should be an easier way to obtain certain higher demand materials from PVE and an easier way to obtain separate higher demand materials from PVP. The more variation there is between PVE and PVP rewards, the better, because it makes each aspect of the game more desirable, at least this is my view.
I also believe the reward ratio of battleground coins should be increased as far as tokens earned per winning game / tokens earned per loss. The ratio may sit comfortably as 4 tokens per win to 1 token per loss or 5 tokens per win to 1 token per loss, I will let the community decide that.
In order to balance the cost of items, put into consideration how easy it is to acquire some of these items in other areas of the game, the amount of time it takes the average player to acquire. As a hypothetical example, let’s say we have a 5-emerald battleground jackpot and the probability of this jackpot occurring is 20%.
5 emeralds * 2/10 games = 1 emerald per game = The average amount of time spent in a game on a corsairs day or the average amount of time spent in a game on a fraywind day. I’m sure you guys have this data and could calculate the average by doing ( average time spent in a game on a corsairs day + average time spent in a game on a fraywind day / 2). However, that math aside to make it more simple, since it is 1 emerald per game, then the amount of battleground coins earned for a win should = 1 emerald in the shop. The price of an emerald can be used as a basis for equalizing the cost of the other items. For example, these are not the real costs, but similar. Let us say that an emerald sells on the broker for 1,500 gold and a superior etching box sells for 3,000 gold. Well, the superior etching box should cost twice as many battleground coins as the 1 emerald on the shop.
Realistically, since items do not have perfect ratios, you can make the battleground coins 15.00 instead of 15 and certain items can be sold for 3.33 tokens or 3.5 tokens based on their gold value, etc.
For the items that do not have a price attached to them or are untradeable on the broker, you can estimate their battleground coin cost by thinking about the average amount of time it takes to acquire said item for a player in another area of the game.
I completely agree with this view from Currian as well, “2 - Valkyon Health Potions, Gem boxes, Bravery Potions, and Rejuvenation Potions have been either guaranteed rewards through vanguard or in general, unfavored due to how little value it provides towards progression. I get that those were put in towards testing what the loot system should be but to be blunt, those are very, very much undesirable to see though they can be labeled as filler items. On top of that BHS are removing bravery potions anyways. As a replacement, maybe we could see otherworldly shards or a diamond in the token shop.”
These items are very abundant in other areas in the game and are very easy to acquire, so there is not much of a reward feeling attached to them. As far as new items are concerned, sprite had some great input about adding in the various tiers of etching materials into the shop. It all goes back to the idea that Battleground rewards should provide the player with certain unique high demand materials that are different from the unique high demand materials acquired from running PVE content. This variation of rewards between pve and pvp will make each side of the game more desireable and increase activity in both areas. I can tell you that dungeons unlocked at level 65 and other end game dungeons have an average que time that is less than the que time for battlegrounds. Providing players with more satisfying and unique rewards special to battlegrounds will decrease que times and ensure that 2-3 ques of a battleground are running at any given time.
I’ve been back to Tera for about a month and before that I did not play since 2014. I’m sure there are other players that have a far superior understanding of what rewards should be added to the battleground coin shop based on the current demand in the marketplace and what items could be unique to battlegrounds that are not already unique to items that have high demand that are earned in pve content/dailies. I will leave it to them to provide feedback in that segment of this analysis. If there is a lack of feedback in the future regarding new items to add to the battleground coin shop, I will be able to provide some suggestions, but as of right now, the more experienced/veteran players set priority to provide their own suggestions to materials that should be added to the battleground coin shop in order to create optimal balance and uniqueness to the rewards. Thank you for taking the time to read my post.
edited June 2018
This thread has been really helpful so far for me to gather up feedback and pass it over to EME. It's been really clear and constructive. Singlebear made a comment today about the BG coins in the EME discord.
I'd like to be able to present them with a few ideas, no promises on what actually gets thrown in there though. I'd like to get a list of items and what you think it'd cost based off how many games you've played and tokens you earned.
Feedback I have so far, please say if I've missed something crucial:
The prices are too high
Having consumables is unoriginal and boring
There are no gold and silver talents.
There are no emeralds
There are no otherworldly shards
Losing games should still earn tokens
What I'm looking for now is lists of items players are looking to see and a price. Keep in mind when suggesting prices and items that unlike Dungeon Coins, BG coins can technically be earned 24/7.
The coin idea was a big step toward a fair reward for the PVPers. I don't do any dungeon, only pvp and some dailys. I believe that there is others like me. So its nice that we can obtain elemental essence from the shop. But as all we know, Time = Money and its not different in the game, not everybody has the time to play hours every day, like myself, so we have to choose what gives a mix of fun and gold.
The majority of the times I do BG's , the win rate is under 50%, and the queues takes like 5~10 min. So to get one essence, it would take a long time and only a few amount of gold in the process. But, its not unusual to get a lot of loses, last weekend I got 14 loses in a row in CS, Yes 14.
So EME needs to balance the Gold x Time for both PVE and PVP content, so my sugestions to the shop are:
- Review the prices of itens;
- Add a token to get the mask with status in the shop. I know that this mask is really hard to get in the dungeons. So it would be similar to the dragon token or the goldfinger. You can obtain a few tokens each day and a chance to get the mask, if don't, you keep the token and, for example, when u reach 40/40 tokens u get the mask. This would increase the numbers of people in the bg queues.
- We could have some loot boxes like the old bonanzas, with gold and silver talents stacks and maybe others things;
- To show some love to the PVP community, add some exclusive BG itens. Each week some good reward (cosmetic, mount, etc) is added to the shop. So we can work to get that exclusive, this would make things a little more interesting;
“I'd like to be able to present them with a few ideas, no promises on what actually gets thrown in there though. I'd like to get a list of items and what you think it'd cost based off how many games you've played and tokens you earned.”
I believe the balancing side of things should be done by EME, because they are the only ones with hard data regarding the probability of old jackpots (5x emeralds) and the average time spent in a battleground, the average time spent qued for a battleground, and the average players win to loss ratio. An important factor regarding Battlegrounds is that you can win or lose in a battleground, it is not a guaranteed loot like a dungeon is (95% of the time, rarely do I ever see a group dismantle because they cannot complete the dungeon due to difficulty). This is why the averages I mentioned above are important and that we use median as a basis for pricing the goods in the shop.
Going back to Currian’s post on this thread, I could not agree more with his thoughts here, “One of the looks of the game in the past that I particularly liked was the relationship between PvP and PvE content. PvE usually contained more optimal ways in terms of gear progression, BUT there were always situations where doing PvP for a specific item or mat was actually more viable than spamming a dungeon in hopes to win the rng roll. Such balance involved players to queue and experience both sides of the game, which I would consider what Tera Online actually is as a whole (another example is doing pvp for jewelry and pve for enchanting). Tera is a wonderful game on itself, why only understand 1/2 of the game?”
It is important to note that my perspective still remains the same. Pve and Pvp can reward a few but not a lot of similar items that are high in demand. However, in order to boost incentives for players to participate in both activities and not isolate and participate in only one of them, there should be unique rewards for both pve and pvp. If we cater to people who only engage in one activity like solely pvp or only pve, then we create a problem where it becomes very difficult to grow and maintain the population of players on both sides.
For instance, if pvpers can earn all the rewards that pvers receive in dungeons, then there is no incentive for those pvpers to touch pve and vice versa. Pvp needs an activity stimulus + higher reward incentives. The solution to this challenge is creating unique rewards for completing battlegrounds via the battleground coins and creating a balance where BG coins earn you more of Item A per hour than completing a dungeon and Dungeons can earn you more of Item B per hour than you can buy with BG coins on the shop. For example, to obtain the most amount of emeralds per hour I would participate in battlegrounds at a chance to earn x5 emeralds when the old jackpot system existed in Tera. Each side (PVP/PVE) should have a balanced number of advantages over the other (Currian’s example of jewelry in pvp + pve for enchanting).
I liked Chase’s idea about adding exclusive BG items to the BG coin shop. Whether it is some new cosmetics, mounts, etc. that you can only earn with the new pvp currency (BG coins).
Some other items I would like to see added to the BG shop are Sapphires, emeralds, diamonds, high tier etching materials, artisan and master additives, rare glyph boxes, and perhaps unique permanent etchings that you can only buy with the bg coin. I’m sure there are a lot of other potential items people want added that I missed out on. Hopefully more people will respond with their item suggestions, but for right now, I will leave the balancing to be done by EME who holds all the data and has competent staff that are assigned to work on balancing rewards in the game. Thank you for reading my wall of text again
All the best,
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