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SUMMER FESTIVAL TOKEN NERF!!?

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Comments

  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Is about the outrageous cost on the Sandy boxes, the time each player would need to get just 1 box, and the fact that is not single character friendly like last year.

    I'm not really disagreeing with you, but what would you recommend as a way of going about this that is "single character friendly" while at the same time not being subject to excessive farming with people of lots of alts or accounts, and can remain stable for a 5 1/2 week period of possible farming?

    I'm glad you asked, i was just about to provide 2 possible ways to fix the issue:

    - Extreme solution: Remove the sandy box altogether, and replace it with a generic useful item everyone will want to farm those same tokens for, such as Golden or Silver Talents. This way you fix the ongoing issue with the talents, and you make sure the sales on swimsuits will stay on point.
    - Remove all swimsuits from the Sandy box. Turn it into a generic accessory box that can yield as well useful consumables like Superior Noctenium Elixir.

    In the end, as i said, The people that will be the most affected by this change, will be those who only farm on a single character or maybe 2. Those players will have absolutely no fun just getting 1 box per week. On the other hand, people with many alts will feel their time is wasted if they are getting so little boxes for the amount of time they are putting into the event.

    This is not about "Is enough 1 box per week" nor excessive farming. This is about making an event fun, enjoyable and rewarding, without limiting your playerbase, which is exactly what EME is doing, by limiting the amount of rewards we can get, and denying easy access to this rewards by people with less amount of characters.
  • Event I’ll be generous I’ll give a 0/10
  • Zoknahal wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Is about the outrageous cost on the Sandy boxes, the time each player would need to get just 1 box, and the fact that is not single character friendly like last year.

    I'm not really disagreeing with you, but what would you recommend as a way of going about this that is "single character friendly" while at the same time not being subject to excessive farming with people of lots of alts or accounts, and can remain stable for a 5 1/2 week period of possible farming?

    I'm glad you asked, i was just about to provide 2 possible ways to fix the issue:

    - Extreme solution: Remove the sandy box altogether, and replace it with a generic useful item everyone will want to farm those same tokens for, such as Golden or Silver Talents. This way you fix the ongoing issue with the talents, and you make sure the sales on swimsuits will stay on point.
    - Remove all swimsuits from the Sandy box. Turn it into a generic accessory box that can yield as well useful consumables like Superior Noctenium Elixir.

    With either of these proposed solutions, you could presumably just leave the existing box there (whether people will save up for it or not) and just add additional separate items like the above to the merchant. (That said, I am guessing they may not be allowed to add gold/silver talents to a farmable event merchant, but only my guess.)
  • voidyvoidy ✭✭✭✭✭
    ElinUsagi wrote: »
    .
    SageWindu wrote: »
    Some misc points regarding this issue partly from the discussion on Discord:
    • Last year's win rate was so generous that it devalued the broker price of all the related costumes and accessories for months (some of them are still devalued now, which was otherwise unheard of in years before that). So I honestly did expect the rate to be nerfed, though maybe this extent (the new price combined with the fact it's not giving smartboxes) is too drastic.

    EME altered the cost of Summer Festival Boxes because some people were having trouble selling them on the broker?

    Sheesh.


    This is a bussiness not a charity house.

    Could've surprised me, with how they deleted half the cash shop recently. :joy:
  • SageWindu wrote: »
    @ElinUsagi @counterpoint

    This is going to sound a little crazy, but if EME made it so that people wanted to spend money, we'd have less threads like this with less comments like mine (for starters).


    Omg omg some GETS it
    If EME made TERA a game that is enjoyable people will spend money regardless. Because they like the game enough that they want to support it, monetary.
    Can we make this guy product manager? only if Seandynamite would understand this concept.
  • 150 for acessories kkkk flop event
    The game is already with few players
    and the event that could bring more people together
    he is spoiled
  • edited June 2018
    ladyraines wrote: »
    Omg omg some GETS it
    If EME made TERA a game that is enjoyable people will spend money regardless. Because they like the game enough that they want to support it, monetary.
    While I respect your pie-in-the-sky "if you build it, they will come" sort of optimism, it's pretty obvious that it's not that simple in practice. If you throw free cash shop items at people just to make them happy, how many of them are really going to buy them on the cash shop? Why would anyone else buy them on the cash shop if they're dirt cheap on the broker -- a literal waste of money? (What are the people who do buy them on the cash shop going to feel when they find out later they could have bought it for 5k gold on the broker and saved their $10+? How likely will they be to buy anything on the cash shop again?) So, you're right to a point (unhappy customers certainly won't spend!), but there's a balancing point to this. EME's run plenty of events in the past that were basically trying to "buy people's happiness" with over-generous rewards, and that isn't really a long-term business strategy. There has to be a middle ground that everyone can accept. (And not saying this right now is it, either.)
  • TJKatTJKat ✭✭✭
    I get it, last year was just too much. I completely agree with that; I had more boxes than I knew what to do with. But this is taking things to the complete opposite extreme. If we were guaranteed to get a swimsuit smartbox, okay, 1 box per character per week I could live with, but with no guarantee of getting a suit for a race/gender I can even use (or of even getting a swimsuit at all), the grind involved is just not worth it.

    I'd been looking forward to this all year. I even have some vacation time right away and was planning on spending a decent chunk of it on this event, but I guess I'm going to stick to logging on long enough to collect calendar rewards and keep up log-in buff, and then go play a fun game instead.

    Also, 6 weeks is too long. I thought the three weeks it ran last year was too long - by the third week, it became a chore. After 6 weeks, i don't think I'm ever going to be looking forward to this event again. None of these events should last more than 2 weeks.
  • edited June 2018
    TJKat wrote: »
    If we were guaranteed to get a swimsuit smartbox, okay, 1 box per character per week I could live with, but with no guarantee of getting a suit for a race/gender I can even use (or of even getting a swimsuit at all), the grind involved is just not worth it.

    If everyone were guaranteed to get a permanent swimsuit for each character they do dailies on every week for 5-6 weeks... that's an awful lot of swimsuits just for doing simple (though repetitive) dailies. It creates the "you'd be stupid to buy them!" effect again, as opposed to just "nice rare reward." I do agree with you, though, that a big part of the problem is the length of the event. If it were a two week event, as you say, then the earning rate you proposed makes more sense.

    (I just want to be clear that I do understand that, the extent of the nerf they did, creates a "you'd be stupid to play!" effect instead, which isn't better either. As I said, there's got to be a happy medium somewhere here.)


    Edit: Oh yeah, just to update, Singlebear mentioned on Discord that he'll work to add the box for the other token in the morning.
  • CatservantCatservant ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2018
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Everything would be fine if EME just add the Sandy box back into the Temple Medallions, and reduce its cost to 20 per claret, and 10 per temple, like the last year.

    Like i said, the shops do not have to have everything the players asked you EME (so far i am the only one who had given you a rough idea of what players would see as a rewarding shop, and thus, would enjoy the festivities) just this small change to the sandy boxes, and you would redeem yourself.

    I wasn't going to add to the thread--far more eloquent people than I have done so. But the above is right.

    I love the Beach event most of all the year. When I had only one character above 48, I could still earn something nice. When my poor computer could not handle dungeons, I could still grind events like this to stockpile something for a little gold later in the year.

    It always felt like a party. It WORKED.

    This.

    I'm pushing like I always do, but it is entirely on faith that you will decide to do something positive about this.

    Unlike some of the others here, I thought you handled the anniversary pretty well. I love the ongoing and varied medium level events every week. I think you are making some positive changes very slowly and with a great deal of thought. And I know it takes a while to integrate a new person into the staff, to figure out who has what responsibility and to partner new talent with the experience to handle a rambunctious lot such as ourselves.

    And I don't think you should blindly trust us--we'll take the store if you let us.

    But. This is a huge deviation from a pattern that worked for the fanbase, with no known downside as far as the players were aware. The reasoning behind this is frankly, opaque to me.

    PLEASE listen, consider, and hopefully use Zoknahal's suggestions to start a conversation. Then give us something worthy of the party.

    ...btw thank you for the water guns. They are wicked awesome cool and completely RNG free. Thank you very much.

    Not however liking the water bombs that show other peoples underwear. That makes me very uncomfortable. Doesn't mean I want you to get rid of them. Just that I really really don't like them.

    EDIT: I finished reading the thread, and Counterpoint's arguments, they make sense. But I am not persuaded completely. Perhaps if the boxes were 72 beach tokens? That's three days work on all beach/Banquet events with one character. Small enough to not be discouraging, but not as generous as last year?
  • CornishRexCornishRex ✭✭✭✭✭
    @counterpoint
    Ok so what's up with eme making events five times as long and spread out the rewards hardcore? Does eme understand the concept of fun?
    None of my friends farmed those anniversary mongos or w.e, they only started farming once the aot bams appeared because, shocker, the mongos were so hard to find nobody even wanted to try. And eme's argument for that was "well the event will last for the whole month so we had to make is sparse, because it totally makes sense a player would a utistically farm these through the whole month!!"
    We will experience the same thing with this event.

    Also, I thought the tradition was that eme makes money off the NEW swimsuits, while players get a chance to get the old swimsuits through ingame means. I can already see which pc member complained they couldn't sell millions of old swimsuits on the broker. I certainly didn't have trouble selling all of mine though so idk what's up with that. God forbid there's one type of cheap costumes to obtain on the broker sheesh...
    Also maybe if bhs made new swimsuits work with bresstchangers they'd make more money, just sayin :)))
  • edited June 2018
    CornishRex wrote: »
    Also, I thought the tradition was that eme makes money off the NEW swimsuits, while players get a chance to get the old swimsuits through ingame means.
    It happened last year, but before that it was only ever the very first 2012 ("series 1"?) costumes that had been available through this event, in the early days. In other years, they kept bringing the older swimsuits back to the store in addition to the new ones. Last year they were both in the event and on the store.

    CornishRex wrote: »
    I can already see which pc member complained they couldn't sell millions of old swimsuits on the broker. I certainly didn't have trouble selling all of mine though so idk what's up with that. God forbid there's one type of cheap costumes to obtain on the broker sheesh...
    First of all, just FWIW, I don't think this had any direct correlation to any PC comments. (I didn't know the price until it launched today, tbh.) Second, because it wasn't discussed, what I'm about to say is just my own opinion about what might be going on.

    I don't think there was any concern last year about being able to sell them on the broker at all. Sure they sold. But the issue is a lot more nuanced than this.

    I'm not saying you have to care, but EME has to care that the items that people pay money for aren't rendered totally valueless by careless over-supply. Last year, as I mentioned, they were both selling all the swimsuits (including via some lootboxes) and giving them away through this event. So imagine you just spent $100 on lootboxes to get the swimsuit you wanted. Then you happen to look on the broker later that same day and see that the same swimsuit is selling for 10k gold because people farmed it to exhaustion via the event. You'd be incensed, and you'd likely never give EME any money again. You can say "buyer beware!" or "they should have looked on the broker first!" but EME can't take that attitude if they want people to give them money.

    It's like... earlier this week, after a very long break, the dyeable Elin maid costumes were finally put up for daily deals for 4995 EMP each. They were wildly in demand and I know a lot of people who bought them. Imagine that today, EME had decided to put them on the medallion merchant for 150 tokens or something. People who literally just spent ~$44 on this would demand their money back. What EME did last year was like that.

    If they were doing like what you said and every year the old costumes were only available in-game, and the new costumes were on the cash shop, that might be a different story (keep in mind that last year they were both selling and giving away)... but even still, you have to be careful. If you sell a lootbox rare this year for $50, but then next year make it plentiful and easy to get in-game for minimal work/gold, people will quickly learn "don't bother buying any swimsuits; just wait until next year and they'll be free." Obviously you don't expect cosmetics to retain their value forever, but you don't want to feel like it was a total waste of money either.

    Anyway, I realize that my saying all this is going to make me the enemy again, but my point isn't to be "against" people who want the prices to go down. (I'm in favor of that too to some degree, unless there's some other explanation about other ways tokens will be earned, as happened with anniversary -- which is quite possible.) I'm just saying that, if they're going to give away cash shop items in-game, particularly ones they're still selling, there has to be some degree of balance. Last year was not balanced at all. (Maybe this year won't be balanced in the opposite direction. We'll see.)

    To be perfectly honest, as Zoknahal alluded to earlier, it's actually safer if they can just keep the cash shop and in-game items completely separate, and come up with some other useful/valuable rewards to farm in-game so that the event will still feel worth it.

    CornishRex wrote: »
    Also maybe if bhs made new swimsuits work with bresstchangers they'd make more money, just sayin :)))

    This one I don't understand either, TBH. (Though if it were up to me, I'd try to make it work with all costumes. Why not.)
  • EllexemEllexem ✭✭✭
    If everyone were guaranteed to get a permanent swimsuit for each character they do dailies on every week for 5-6 weeks... that's an awful lot of swimsuits just for doing simple (though repetitive) dailies. It creates the "you'd be stupid to buy them!" effect again, as opposed to just "nice rare reward." I do agree with you, though, that a big part of the problem is the length of the event. If it were a two week event, as you say, then the earning rate you proposed makes more sense.

    Perhaps they should have looked back to that one blue box hunt event, that had permanent swimsuits as one reward options, and included temporary versions as the padding material, rather than just hiking up prices.

    People would of course still complain, and consider the temporary swimsuits and other costume items as worthless, but even a low rate of permanent costumes bolstered by the temporary items would have felt nicer. People might consider them a booby prize, but they'd still trigger that "I got something" response. Low investment for a chance, pleasant surprise if it turns out to be more, rather than high-investment for almost guaranteed disappointment.

    At least that is how the current cost structure, along with its pure loot-box RNG nature with not even a smart box, comes across to me for the Sandy boxes.

  • voidyvoidy ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 2018
    ladyraines wrote: »
    Omg omg some GETS it
    If EME made TERA a game that is enjoyable people will spend money regardless. Because they like the game enough that they want to support it, monetary.
    While I respect your pie-in-the-sky "if you build it, they will come" sort of optimism, it's pretty obvious that it's not that simple in practice.
    It is, though. When I first started playing this game four years ago, I came from Maplestory, which was notoriously pay to win. For just a bit of context, the Maplestory front page was full of cash shop promotional ads, every event was basically a cash grab, and you had to pay real money for a "license" to sell things in their brokerage system. I left feeling disgusted with the game, and saw Tera as a breath of fresh air. Their front page, back then at least, had maybe one cash shop advertisement but the rest of the page was purely about content. Content I could do without dropping hundreds of dollars on the cash shop to enchant my gear. Everything felt within reach, and the support team was super helpful with an issue I had as well, so when I got paid later I felt really good about dropping money on this game's cash shop and even subscribing. Back then, I spent more money on the game than I do on most vidya, because it was genuinely enjoyable and I wanted to support the team that was making such a fun experience possible. I don't think I'm the only one who felt that way about the game and its publisher, but anyone who might chime in to agree with me has probably long since quit the game.

    Might just be being optimistic, but I really do think if you just create an enjoyable experience that people form a vested interest in, they'll support you financially to show their support. I think there's definitely a strong psychological component to it, where people don't like having their arm twisted and will be more likely to do something if they feel like they have a choice in the matter, or like the person they're benefiting has already helped them in some way. Tera had a great system for this because it provided a fun experience and the cash shop actually had nice stuff in it, so for someone looking for a fun mmo to play and support, tera filled that niche easily. Nowadays, half the shop's missing and the game itself sucks. Legit confused about how this is supposed to make them money but hey I guess they know more than us pie in the sky guys haha.
  • XynianaXyniana ✭✭
    edited June 2018
    10 days = 120 tokens.
    Not even a single box with some ***** acessory or unusable swimsuit for wrong race
    Thanks for another useless event. Thanks for saving my time.
    Greedy game. You're becoming worse than RU-TERA
This discussion has been closed.