Just saw elitism in GLSNM, smh PVErs gotta stop being so picky

124

Comments

  • I really don't see what's so fricking hard... Make your own parties if you constantly get frustrated with people in Instance Matching System. If you're instancing, you kind of SHOULD be expecting to get people who may not know that much about what they're supposed to be doing. Why would you que expecting everyone in party to be geared? SUFFER IN LFG AND MAKE YOUR OWN PARTY... simple as that...

  • LapomkoLapomko ✭✭✭

    @JasonGenerix said:
    I really don't see what's so fricking hard... Make your own parties if you constantly get frustrated with people in Instance Matching System. If you're instancing, you kind of SHOULD be expecting to get people who may not know that much about what they're supposed to be doing. Why would you que expecting everyone in party to be geared? SUFFER IN LFG AND MAKE YOUR OWN PARTY... simple as that...

    Population is very low now and can take forever to fill your LFG so people have no choice to queue.

  • @Zulia69 said:
    The population is now in the 600s, which is down 500 since last August!!

    https://steamcharts.com/app/323370

    The population is down, but as was also said, people left Steam to use the EME Launcher when they offered the free giveaway as well (this happened right near end-May/early-June, when you see a corresponding drop-off on Steam). Using Steam alone to determine the game's population isn't accurate.

  • @39HATFDXLY said:
    lol what I mean is that not everyone has maxed out gear and there are people who want to level alts or just play for fun. Being an elitist drives those people away and unfortunately, that's why (ofc in addition to eme's choices) that the player base is dying so much. Rather then kicking someone for not knowing the mechanics, it's better to explain it to them and help them learn the mechanics for the dungeon. Also if you're actually speedrunning / going for ranking on a dungeon, it's better to play static instead of joining IM / running IM and then being elitist and toxic in it.

    This so much THIS! I keep trying to tell people if you want the player base to grow and new players to stay you have to be a little kinder and more patient!

  • FainallFainall ✭✭
    edited August 20

    @Christin said:
    It would be so flipping amazing if they could let us do or learn dungeons with NPC's. Like if there is a 2-person party, they could pick the other 3 players as NPC's. Oh well, we can always dream. Until then, there will be more threads like this.

    I feel sorry for both sides. Tough for people to learn when always getting kicked, but not sure why players farming dungeons would want to take the time. Even with lower level dungeons you always got that player that can't be bothered to learn anything about the dungeon before going in. Hence why joining a guild and making friends is so important in a game like this if you want to farm dungeons.

    I don't know...I have played a lot of MMO's and I have never had much issues with guilds until I came to Tera cause I am a pretty chill sort of girl. I have always found a guild that suited and made friends in the game with one or two tries and stuck with those guilds. But guilds on here can be pretty toxic and elitist in their own right even when they don't deserve to be. People are clique-ish, you join a big guild and there is no sense of community...just the same 5 people running Bahaar over and over and everyone else being ignored. You join a smaller guild and they act like they want to be a big guild, but they don't have the skills or the right balance of people. You join a fun guild and they don't run dungeons. I have been through so many guilds on this game it's nuts. I finally gave up and decided to be a solo player and just randomly join que's and hope for the best. Sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn't. But again I am pretty chill so I don't get all excited when someone doesn't know a thing or is a little under geared. I usually try to explain how to do stuff.

    On a bit of a different note, the dungeon mechs for this game are vastly different than anything else I have ever played and like someone else said you can watch all vids you want but until you do it you just don't get it. Getting it can take a few runs. Just like swimming in Bathysmal to get rid of the debuff...it's funny but seriously a bizarre mech. Some of the mechs are pretty convoluted and if you aren't used to that type of thing it can take a while to properly learn it.

    Also I understand some people have limited time to play and don't want to explain stuff, but the reality is if you want to do a rando run on a dungeon and are short of time...don't do it. Either go with friends or wait until you have time to que for that dungeon. Because you just don't know what you are going to get when you que up.

  • ChristinChristin ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 22

    Depending on the dungeon, but at least watching vids will help know the main issues of the dungeon. The ones saying vids don't help are the ones too lazy to bother watching them. At least read a guide or something so you know when to hide behind rocks etc.

    I think a large problem these days is people want hand-holding and to tell those experienced in a dungeon they should just not play if they don't want to coddle an adult through a dungeon. Making all of these excuses as to why a team needs to carry you isn't right either. Telling players they shouldn't IM cause that is for the ignorant is ridiculous. Maybe people that don't know what they are doing should be the ones making parties in LFG. If you do a high level dungeon, you should at least know your class, know the basic mechs of the dungeon (main things to need to do to survive and not wipe yourself or your team) and have the proper gear. That's really not a lot to ask.

    I think those on the side of the dying dungeon players just have no idea how bad some people are and to what extent players want a total carry. I also think a good point would be to require players to be skilled in the dungeon preceding each dungeon in order to be able to que for that dungeon. Too many times, people without a clue just want to spam the event dungeons with no idea on how to do much of anything.

  • FainallFainall ✭✭
    edited August 22

    I am in no way lazy. I have watched lots of vids and came away without much understanding of what to do. I watched the vid for Manglemire five times and we still couldn't complete it, and I am pretty sure it's because we couldn't figure out the mechs. Also people need to remember they weren't born knowing these dungeons either. There IS a learning curve. I have never ever expected to be carried or coddled through anything. But that doesn't mean a little explanation isn't warranted.

    The reality is if you want good players and a player base that simply doesn't leave and go to other games you have to be a little bit nice, patient and explain things. Explaining and being a little patient while people learn isn't carrying.

    Also how are you supposed to get skilled in a dungeon if you can't que to do it? How would you even regulate that? There are dungeons I want to do, I am geared to do, but I am terrified to que for them because I don't know how to do them and I am afraid to go in with random players. It's a game, it's not something you want people screaming at you for because you simply don't know the mechs yet. Believe it or not, games are supposed to be fun.

  • edited August 22

    Ok call me suspicious but this post seems like bait. I know I'm really late to this but I've seen tons of posts like this on the wow forums, so i'm taking it with a grain of salt. Let's just say this isn't bait and op is being honest and not just making up a story to push a "Muh evil elitists" narrative.
    What I'm going to say is just to people in general not directly at op.

    People in this thread have given all the solutions possible to many problems so I will line the ones I like up in short points.

    1. Join a not dead guild. (Guilds can offer players willing to teach you the dungeons you want to run much more patient than people in ims that just want to get their dgs over quick)
    2. Look up info on your class and the dungeons. There are discords and websites like essentialmana and youtube that offer guides that get to the point.
    3. Don't expect to be carried. It's not other players jobs to handhold you if you put in no effort to learn. If you try to que for gls and don't know it after a few times, maybe its somewhat your fault for not giving the effort to learn.
    4. Try to find people in the discords that are willing to help you.
    5. Don't be an [filtered] to people. I have no context to what was said between everybody so I can't say what was said and this is more in general but its not worth arguing in ques, that will get you blacklisted.
    6. Do the 65 questline to get your gear.
    7. There will be jerks, Ignore them and leave. It's that simple. Instead of arguing just drop from the party. It's not hard. One que in a video game isn't the end of the world. Your pride isn't worth wasting even more time that you could spend doing other things. A lot of the time these "Toxic" (I hate that word because of how people misuse it on the most menial things) players tend to be that way because people get into an argument and verbal shots get fired so to say. Just drop and keep it moving.

    Cheers.

  • I think what a lot of it comes down to is when you have a game this old, you always have those players...of which I run into a surprising amount of...that say I have been playing this game since it was P2P. We are talking years here. So they know every dungeon, they know all the mechs from doing them hundreds of times, and they ran out of patience with new players who don't know stuff ages ago. It's second nature for them, and they have played SO long that they have forgotten what it's like to come into this game new from another game that maybe doesn't work the same. I don't blame them for that, they have earned the right to breeze through these dungeons. But they haven't earned the right to scream at someone who doesn't know it just because they haven't done it. The last two games I played right before this one were so different. One had basically tank and spank bosses in dungeons with practically no mechs required. The game was a challenge in a very different way. The other one had complicated mechs but again they were challenging in a very different way. Everyone has different ways they learn things, it doesn't mean they aren't trying or don't want to. Also I have asked about a couple harder dungeons and I always get the same response...blah blah dungeon is easy. No...things are only easy if you know how to do it. But if you don't, it's usually not easy at first. Of course I understand there will always be people who don't want to do the work, but I do believe there are plenty who do. Quite frankly the one time I was in a dungeon where someone blatantly wanted to be carried was in fact an experienced player who was in all HO+3. He even said I am not going to do anything, you can carry me. We just left the party because he was the tank.

    Also something I have learned on my time on here is how incredibly much your keyboard makes a difference. (I don't use a game controller.) For instance, when I started fishing I couldn't catch a BAF for anything. Later I got a new keyboard cause my old one wore out and had no trouble catching BAF's with a level 3 rod. Now two keyboards later, I bought a fancy gaming keyboard this time and I can barely reel in a BAF with a level 5 rod and fish salad. On the first keyboard I couldn't climb those floating rocks on quests where you had to get to the top of something...talk about frustrated. Now I can hop right up them. So sometimes that makes a difference as well. There are a lot of variables as to why people can and can't do something that isn't ALWAYS specific to their attitude or laziness factor. When you come into this game new it can be a bit overwhelming. There are a LOT of things to know. Then by the time you get really good at a dungeon, they replace it. Of course that keeps things fresh and interesting, but it also makes it a lot harder for people who haven't done it before.

  • edited August 22

    I'm not sure what you're getting at. You seem to be conflating experienced players with people who scream and yell at people. I addressed almost everything you just said in my earlier post. I've been a veteran of many mmos and to be frank you can simply take precautions and keep it movin instead of whining on the forums.
    1. There will always be jerks. Either drop and find a new party or go with your guildies/join a guild.
    2. I don't think anyone worth listening to is saying it's soley because you aren't trying. Only you know if you are trying to learn, however easy dungeons like gls or drc should not take very long to learn.
    3. Just because there are idiots that don't want to do the work, doesn't mean there's a problem. Just do as you did and drop.
    4. I feel you on the keyboard thing, my hands are almost the size of dinner plates so there's a problem there, however I don't see how jumping puzzles from quests relate to most dgs. That's a keyboard problem you fixed. I know there's one with the farty caterpillar one but not many more.
    5. I think you're getting way too emotional over this. Obviously Rome wasn't built in a day but blaming other people when you don't progress isn't always their fault.
    As long as you put in effort most sensible people will help a new player.

  • Anyone else think guides on Essential Mana are horribly written and have been since the dawn of time? I think the average user can probably make as much sense out of legal documents as EM guides i.e. next to none. I never had much cause to read them personally since I've learned every dungeon completely blind (the best way to learn, adapt and improve as a player), but whenever someone has directed me to them I've always thought to myself "how can a guide be so incoherent and make such simple actions sound so needlessly complex".

    It's almost no wonder my experience with the community before I burned out the first time was of people having absolutely zero enthusiasm or willingness to learn new dungeons, I think some of them took a single glance at a guide and just completely noped out of ever wanting to step outside their comfort zone.

    Also:

    @Fainall said:
    But guilds on here can be pretty toxic and elitist in their own right even when they don't deserve to be. People are clique-ish, you join a big guild and there is no sense of community...just the same 5 people running Bahaar over and over and everyone else being ignored. You join a smaller guild and they act like they want to be a big guild, but they don't have the skills or the right balance of people. You join a fun guild and they don't run dungeons. I have been through so many guilds on this game it's nuts. I finally gave up and decided to be a solo player and just randomly join que's and hope for the best.

    This is ultimately my personal reason for walking away. It wasn't the same 5 people per se, but it was a core group that kept dragging in "friends" from outside the guild constantly and training up people we had no idea who they even were, while people like myself who were more than capable but needed an opportunity to run (and asked for help, multiple times) got completely ignored or told "welp, that's a shame". I can't say that's a Tera thing though, I think it's just a people thing and a sign of the times more than anything else. That being said, after my original guild experienced a rapid unscheduled disassembly I spent 2 years trying to find somewhere to call home - and ultimately settled for a private guild of just two people. Nowhere was home.

  • Essentialmana dungeon guides are concise and simple. What are you smoking that makes you not be able to understand them? They are hardly complex but I guess some people have different learning capacities eh? If its hard for you to understand, then by all means that's fine. Just don't trash other people's hard work just because its hard for you to understand.

  • FainallFainall ✭✭
    edited August 23

    Albedo I am not even remotely emotional over anything. It's interesting that you read it that way....I guess when you can't hear someone speaking. The jumping quests and fishing comment was simply to illustrate the point that your keyboard has a lot to do with things, and that can actually effect how you respond in dungeons as well. So can things you can't control like server lag, etc. The point was not everyone or every thing is created equal, and it can effect how game play is executed, and differences in people effect how they learn. The bottom line for me is people just need to be a bit kinder and more patient. This is a game, we aren't curing cancer here.

    Myth I get it, there are days when I wonder why on earth I am here because of things like you mentioned. Sadly the people you interact with really do play a part in your gaming experience.

  • LapomkoLapomko ✭✭✭
    edited August 23

    Why essentialmana when you can just use the Hack Tool. This game is a joke now since every brain defect can use a module to tell you every boss attacks and mechanic. Whenever i'm learning a dungeon, every person tells me to dl the module... Before you were big guy when you could clear top dungeon now every button mashing script warrior joe can clear all top dungeon.

This discussion has been closed.