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The Predatory Pet/Servant System: A ridiculous average of around $75,000USD paywall for Best In Slot

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Comments

  • ChristinChristin ✭✭✭✭
    edited June 17
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    I dont need to read the entire post to know that you are literally, putting on the same level, spending money = progress.

    I have seen true P2W, i have played my fair share of those kind of games. I would be a fool if i do not recognize this new servant system as a somewhat p2w, because as of right now, the best way to obtain pets and servants, is through the Companion Loot Box.

    If we NEEDED servants at 50 fellowship to "progress", clear content, then it would be a P2W mechanic in full fledge. However, you can still access every single part of the content without a servant.
    Sure, i will admit that there will be a group of players that will want you to have a servant with that amount of fellowship due to the increased damage, and this, that, my theory craft, "Because if you deal X amount of damage multiplied by the decimal amount of the hypotenuse of Y,Z and fellowship number...." yada yada yada, all that theory crafting thing, you get the point.
    This groups will for sure, clear content much faster than the rest due to their overpowered servants. But does it stop you from clearing the same content? Are you obliged to spend that amount of money to clear content? to "progress"?
    No

    Ask yourself question before claiming that you NEED a high fellowship pet to "progress" : Can i clear content without it?

    Sure, the servant system is flawed, and it eventually makes you see the "need" to spend money to get pets to evolve into servants, due to the fact that the main item in game to obtain pets, is heavily locked behind an extremely low drop rate, and you still need to fight against other players for it if it happens to drop from a dungeon boss or BAM.

    But that doesnt mean the servant is needed to "progress"

    Pretty much your entire post is about how you are seeing the NEED to have a servant to CLEAR CONTENT, PROGRESS.

    We get it, is a predatory system, its flawed, and your math is very much welcomed to warn others about the insane cost that would be needed in order to get a 50 fellowship servant, but in the end, you DO NOT NEED a 50 fellowship servant to clear content, is optional, like it is spending money in the game.

    Their posts isn't that we NEED the best or highest fellowship pet. Their point is simply why do players put up with bull like this? BHS can get away with adding a cashcow like partners into the game, because players are simply that desperate to have the best and the top of everything. The OP is mainly pointing out the greed of BHS, and since no pet sale whatsoever, I'd have to include the greed of EME.

    It's not that players have to have the best, it's more like why does BHS and EME have to be so greedy? I am not even trying to get the best pet, but they're even sticking it to the little guys that just want to try to get the new partners. The entire system is predatory and hoping that people don't know what they are doing to use up pets that they have paid good money to get. The confusion around this whole partner system is disgusting. EME dumped partners on us deliberately without providing ANY information about how the system worked. They did not provide ANY percentages on ANY of the rng attributes to this new system. They added it to the game and walked away. That alone leaves me with a bitter taste about all of this.

    My main has eaten over 25 pets and is left with a Marie (grade 2) and a Coco (grade 6). Honestly, I am so over this partner system. No Kunkun, No Loo, just nothing but Maries and Cocos. With the rng luck I've had with this partner system, there is no way I will ever buy another loot box. I don't care about fellowship, I just wanted some nice partners with some cool bonus skills. It's like the more I try with this system, the worse my luck gets. Sure, people are dumping loads of cash into this new system, but all they will be left with in the end is regret. Even if they get a top pet, the credit card bill needs to get paid at some point. That's when the regret begins. Of course, with so many others getting top pets to, it might not be as worth it as they thought it would be. No doubt the only reason they ponied up all of that cash is to be one of the few with a top level pet. Oh well, nice try.
  • ChristinChristin ✭✭✭✭
    ManamiC wrote: »
    I want to tell you a story everyone.

    I am a immature, dumb, 16 year old kid. I have been playing Tera for a while and always consistently played because of friends and thrill of the fun. Around two to three months ago, the new dungeon patch and pet system was released to NA. As anyone else who followed the patch, we all knew it was some BS P2W content used to have a steep rng system in order to have money, and many compared it to the BDO pet enchanting system that has been generating their developers a ton of money over a few years. Yet this pet system we got is much worse in terms of the unfair benefits it can potentially be and the AMOUNT OF SPENDING REQUIRED TO KEEP TRYING TO GET A BETTER PET.

    Now I am a naive kid who just want to play video games. I have been working a little side job for a few years and always used the money I make to fund some new game I enjoy once in a while or buy a skin or two whenever there is a good sale, pretty typical in my opinion. Now the pet we got had a major advantage where you could have up to +40 power buff whenever you toggle the pet and even more importantly, there was an exploit where as long as you resummon the pet, you could have the BUFF THE ENTIRE TIME OF AN INSTANCE, which of course many people abused. Tera is a funny game where there is a wide variety of players with different financial strengths. One PvE static I ran dungeons with spent a lot of money for the pet, as it gave us a heavy advantage in clearing speed and for another month, I was constantly pressured to do the same both from them and from myself to do better. Slowly I spent money every week for a chance to roll on a better pet. I spent 100s a week, thousands eventually. Before I knew it (and this is my fault ofc) I had used all the money I saved up for a while meant for buying other titles in summer and my pretty small college fund. I was filled with regrets and self frustration towards myself for a long time and it ruined my mental state as a student. Frankly, because of my greed but also the predatory system Tera KNEW was addicting and demanding, it made me feel very upset, depressed and just angry for a very long time. I hope this system either be improved, more accessible to players without swiping tons of money, or just reviewed on a hiatus cause it is just designed to be unfair yet pushes people to WANT to keep trying because it gives you a hefty advantage. Severely.

    Cmon guys we all know why they put this system in so suddenly. Profit and draining money from players in the game.




    -I am a lost boy from Neverland
    Usually hanging out with Peter Pan
    And when we're bored we play in the woods
    Always on the run from Captain Hook

    This is why it's so very important to get into more than one game. That way, when a game introduces something like this, a player can walk away until the hype is over. Don't beat yourself up too much as you would have had to learn this lesson eventually. I learned mine after moving out and blowing all my money on clothes and shoes. We all blow a bunch of money at some point, but we get through it by knowing not to ever do it again. The next time something like this happens, just remember the regret you have over this. It will really help you down the road.

    Yes, it's an awful system and really making BHS and EME out to be horrible predators. No doubt, they'll be coming out with new partners in the future that have maybe 2 additional skills or something to them to encourage the gamblers to go further. I always tell my kids never to take the bait, because something else will come out bigger and better than the last. It's always a never ending cycle that people get trapped into.
  • It's funny how you guys can complain how a Free-To-Play MMO has grindy/expensive game mechanics when there used to be a time when the exact same game had a monthly subscription service just to play it.

    That's just the nature of the beast, folks. MMORPGs have always been "games as a service" before "games as a service" was even a thing *coughEAcoughActivisioncough*. Either they make you pay a subscription to play, or they monetize parts of the system while keeping the main game free.
  • TJKatTJKat ✭✭✭
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    you DO NOT NEED a 50 fellowship servant to clear content
    Yet.

    How long do you think it will be before BHS starts balancing the game around having OP servants?

  • ChristinChristin ✭✭✭✭
    TJKat wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    you DO NOT NEED a 50 fellowship servant to clear content
    Yet.

    How long do you think it will be before BHS starts balancing the game around having OP servants?

    Or how long before those that have OP servants start complaining that the dungeons etc. are too easy for them. They love to brag/complain that content is too easy.
  • MelyodisMelyodis ✭✭✭
    Holocauxt wrote: »
    It's funny how you guys can complain how a Free-To-Play MMO has grindy/expensive game mechanics when there used to be a time when the exact same game had a monthly subscription service just to play it.

    That's just the nature of the beast, folks. MMORPGs have always been "games as a service" before "games as a service" was even a thing *coughEAcoughActivisioncough*. Either they make you pay a subscription to play, or they monetize parts of the system while keeping the main game free.

    Even though your correct they will still complain. I just want to know if they needed a partner/servant last year when glshm came out to clear.
  • ChristinChristin ✭✭✭✭
    Melyodis wrote: »
    Holocauxt wrote: »
    It's funny how you guys can complain how a Free-To-Play MMO has grindy/expensive game mechanics when there used to be a time when the exact same game had a monthly subscription service just to play it.

    That's just the nature of the beast, folks. MMORPGs have always been "games as a service" before "games as a service" was even a thing *coughEAcoughActivisioncough*. Either they make you pay a subscription to play, or they monetize parts of the system while keeping the main game free.

    Even though your correct they will still complain. I just want to know if they needed a partner/servant last year when glshm came out to clear.

    Both of these comments state facts yet have really nothing to do with the OP. The fact that the game had a subscription and the fact that games monetize has nothing to do with the point made in the OP that BHS and EME have encouraged a system that clearly exploits players. Many games monetize, but they do have some limitations as to the greed. Even $15 is more affordable than maxing out a partner, and no doubt many players would rather pay the $15 per month to have everything maxed.

    Even if you could come up with loads of other examples of greed, it still wouldn't negate the points from the OP nor would it justify the extreme greed in this case. Just because many are doing the same thing, doesn't make it right.
  • ErazusErazus ✭✭
    edited June 18
    66ECX7NAN7 wrote: »
    There's a leaderboard for GLSH, Bahaar, Petrax and people with p2w partner buff have a clear advanatage there lol

    There are a lot more buffs that are much more important like the bonuses for the skills which can give extra damage plus +20 power and +40 crit factor ( if you have these maxed then you are way ahead of someone with a partner as long as you have a decent partner yourself )... plus the luck to find and get some really good infused stats ( it is possible to get +8 power infused on chest as example ).

    We also have the new jewelry that give so much more stats...


    Of course.. I am not saying that the partner system is not broken in terms of costs/bonuses but at the same time there are much more other things that are as much as broken and yet do not require to invest that much gold... Which makes the partner system to not be entirely overpowered as long as anyone has a decent partner with a permanent power buff ..

    All of these things you mentioned are within reach of attainability as a person that plays the game. All the people that go for leaderboards have all of those things, this is a weak argument. However $75,000USD is not. It is beyond absurdity. Do you not realize how much $75,000USD is? For a pet (which is part of one of the million other contents) in a video game?

    If a person cares enough to spend thousands upon thousands of dollars for a pet, you are well assured that they have "bonuses for the skills" (or the proper term, skill advancements) up to date... It is like you think a casual player that only has frostmetal or stormcry is going to spend that much on a pet when there is other, way easier, things to get to increase your DPS. Also, they'll spend thousands and thousands of dollars on gear first before pets.

    Also, for 1 grade 10 servant, it is a minimum of 742k gold... The average fellowship of 1 servant at grade 10 is 28. You need at least 35 fellowship on a gold servant, 37 on a blue and 39 on a green (18 power... 40 power is the max btw so not even half way to the maximum amount). Good luck getting that if you do not have 3m+ to blow on a pet (to which is the equivalent of $200-300USD).

    And of course there are more important things for DPS lol, a HO+3 weapon compared to a SC+0 weapon is one lol. I do not need to explain further why what you are saying is a bit oblivious with what I just mentioned.

    And yes, 8% more damage because of a pet is overpowered for leaderboards when the DPS difference between some players of the same classes is 1-2%.........
  • edited June 18
    The thing that makes this system problematic is especially because of the way it plays on the psychology of hardcore competitive players who actually care about having that slight competitive edge (even if it were just 1%). All it really takes is for one competitive player to have ultra-good RNG and/or spend a certain amount of money to get a top servant. Now all of a sudden these competitive players will feel they can't compete fairly unless they too invest in pets/servants, and every day they wait means another day they're behind the pack. Appealing to people's competitive nature to get them to spend more money -- potentially a near-endless pit of money due to unbound RNG -- is questionable at best (to put it lightly).

    The vast majority of casual or even many core players really won't care about this at all -- maybe they spend a bit of money (if at all), get a reasonable servant with a cool skill, and that's good enough -- so long as they can do all the content they want without holding anyone back, it's fine. (And it's true that servants are not a "requirement" for clearing content.) But this whole system is hyper-targeted at competitive players, and no matter what options there are to earn them in-game at a trickle rate it's not really a fair choice when you're competing with others already a step ahead.

    If you look at all the other previous similar systems in the game -- even those that interface with the cash shop -- they all ultimately had some fixed cap on RNG. Even if the inner armor or dragon were in a cash shop lootbox, it was going to drop, and when that happened, that was that. Here, the system has all the trappings of a long-time gear grind, but where the essential ingredient is sold for cash. This is not the direction the developers or publishers should take monetization in this game -- even if it actually worked.
  • EllexemEllexem ✭✭✭
    This is not the direction the developers or publishers should take monetization in this game -- even if it actually worked.

    I don't know, this seems to be the perfectly logical evolution of their brain-bug about not wanting everyone to be able to get the best gear. We've been told repeatedly that they want to have that be rare. If only a vanishingly small number of people actually have a max fellowship partner, then that would be exactly what they want.

    The predatory monetization aspects seem more like a side-effect of that main goal. (Though I'm really not putting it past them to have it be fully intended as well, not after the adventure coin bait and switch with the dungeon entries.)

    This system, as presented, seems to be epitome of not (realistically) feasible to brute-force. Everything else players have been able to work around, but this system you can't really force. There is no failure cap of any sort, you need to get lucky at least 8 times in a row (a minimum of five times 5 or 6 and four times a 6, or eight times a 6 and then a single one), the quality of the inputs doesn't matter at all for the outcome (so sacrificing a higher fellowship partner doesn't seem to help at all, if I understand it correctly), and there is a cap of possible tries per item.

    So you either get lucky or it isn't happening, no matter how much money or how many resources you throw at the problem. (It's independent events, after all, it's not like nearing or exceeding the average before a winning combination is rolled changes the outcome of the individual rolls. The only thing that changes is the probability of being just that unlucky.)

    I don't really expect anything to change there until Bluehole finally stops pursuing the goal of only a small number of people being supposed to even have the best gear. (Please note that this isn't meant to say that they need to make it easy to get it, just that they need to move away from wanting systems that are designed to make it impossible for as many people as want to reach that gear.)
  • SageWinduSageWindu High Seat of the Jedi Council ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ellexem wrote: »
    This is not the direction the developers or publishers should take monetization in this game -- even if it actually worked.

    I don't know, this seems to be the perfectly logical evolution of their brain-bug about not wanting everyone to be able to get the best gear. We've been told repeatedly that they want to have that be rare. If only a vanishingly small number of people actually have a max fellowship partner, then that would be exactly what they want.

    Which is so utterly boneheaded, I believe. Sure, realistically only a small percentage of the player base will get to "the end", but actually building the game itself around that is mind-boggling.

    Remember when DS came back and EME outright said something akin to "not everyone will be able to do this"? Why would you say something like that? You're telling your players that if they're not a big-d**k BiS metagamer they shouldn't bother.

    Don't they want people to play the game? Why keep introducing systems - or use dog-whistling - that prevent people from doing so?
  • TaldekTaldek ✭✭
    edited June 19
    The increased potential infinite rng systems are really bad and only getting worse over time, the servant system is the worst offender so far. Relic/Halidom have a potential of never upgrading and a static chance no matter what. Servants take this to the next level with it not really being obtainable through playing, not reasonably. You could dump thousands of dollars and still not get a decently high fellowship or even a gold pet.

    People made the point that you dont need it to clear content. While true, heres a counterpoint: Is your character weaker without it? if so, people are gonna care. It creates both a reality and a perception of being behind, always. Dragons, innerwear, EP, and gear can all be gotten with time, alot of time in some case, but youll get there eventually. Relics/Halidoms and even more so Servants you can potentially NEVER get a good one and theres no control or fallback mechanic. Its an awful system on its own and made worse by largely paywall rng.
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