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x2 Drops, same old sh*t... 3 times, same run...

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Comments

  • TWMagimayTWMagimay ✭✭✭✭✭
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    I've said it before and I'll say it again... the game needs a "need/greed" system, as they have in many other MMOs. It's a really simple solution that all-but-solved this problem a long time ago. Alas...

    This is probably an odd question but...how exactly does that work? It's one of those things everyone seems to have seen yet was never present in games I played(at least played to the point of caring about loot). While I understand the idea, the mechanics of it...can't quite seem to figure it out.

    Basically it just means that anyone who can actually use the item ("need") gets priority for that loot.

    If it's gear that you can actually use on your character, you have the "Need" option. Everybody has the "Greed" option (including those with "Need"). So, when it rolls, if one or more people chose Need, it rolls only between those people and the winner in the Need pool gets the loot; the Greed pool is ignored. If no one chose Need (either because no one is eligible or because the people who were eligible chose Greed instead), then it rolls between everyone in the Greed pool. So, in this way, if you're the only one in your party who could actually use a piece of loot, you're guaranteed to get it if you want it; if there are multiple people in your party who can use it and want it, the competition is limited only to that group, increasing your odds. Only when nobody needs an item does it become "free-for-all" loot.

    For the situation described in this thread, it would nearly eliminate the problem.

    And what's to stop people from always choosing "need"?
  • LesbianViLesbianVi ✭✭✭✭✭
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    I've said it before and I'll say it again... the game needs a "need/greed" system, as they have in many other MMOs. It's a really simple solution that all-but-solved this problem a long time ago. Alas...

    This is probably an odd question but...how exactly does that work? It's one of those things everyone seems to have seen yet was never present in games I played(at least played to the point of caring about loot). While I understand the idea, the mechanics of it...can't quite seem to figure it out.

    Basically it just means that anyone who can actually use the item ("need") gets priority for that loot.

    If it's gear that you can actually use on your character, you have the "Need" option. Everybody has the "Greed" option (including those with "Need"). So, when it rolls, if one or more people chose Need, it rolls only between those people and the winner in the Need pool gets the loot; the Greed pool is ignored. If no one chose Need (either because no one is eligible or because the people who were eligible chose Greed instead), then it rolls between everyone in the Greed pool. So, in this way, if you're the only one in your party who could actually use a piece of loot, you're guaranteed to get it if you want it; if there are multiple people in your party who can use it and want it, the competition is limited only to that group, increasing your odds. Only when nobody needs an item does it become "free-for-all" loot.

    For the situation described in this thread, it would nearly eliminate the problem.

    And what's to stop people from always choosing "need"?

    in other MMOs if not mistaken works on ilvl or something like that, for example LKNM has 410 basic, that system can be set on that.
  • aeee98aeee98 ✭✭✭✭
    Chances are you have (free) elite for at least 3 days when the drop rate is up

    Elite gives you 8 runs on LKNM instantly through 4 runs + 4 runs with the given reset scroll in the dungeon. For SSNM you can get 12 runs instantly since you can use normal instance reset scrolls (I ignore veteran ones because they are hard to come by). Multiply that by three days, and you get a whooping 36 runs on SSNM. Each run in SSNM gives 2-4 pieces of armor assuming everyone is alive at the time the boss is dead (Drop rate increases by number of players alive in the instance. That means you have 72-144 chances of getting armor. Last I know, not every run people will roll on the Armor piece.

    If you are telling me you get outrolled 72 times, you probably should try the lottery. If it is just that one off run, just let go lol. (Also it is silly to say if they are doing for their alts since it will be easier to get it on their alts themselves, especially Tank/Healer meaning easier queues).

    And if you are asking, yes if I want to run 36 runs of SSNM/SSHM (and my computer can finally render cage phase) I would.

    I can totally understand if it wasn't double drop and queues weren't popping (if you were queuing as a dps). But in all seriousness you are just unlucky that run.
  • counterpointcounterpoint mod
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    I've said it before and I'll say it again... the game needs a "need/greed" system, as they have in many other MMOs. It's a really simple solution that all-but-solved this problem a long time ago. Alas...

    This is probably an odd question but...how exactly does that work? It's one of those things everyone seems to have seen yet was never present in games I played(at least played to the point of caring about loot). While I understand the idea, the mechanics of it...can't quite seem to figure it out.

    Basically it just means that anyone who can actually use the item ("need") gets priority for that loot.

    If it's gear that you can actually use on your character, you have the "Need" option. Everybody has the "Greed" option (including those with "Need"). So, when it rolls, if one or more people chose Need, it rolls only between those people and the winner in the Need pool gets the loot; the Greed pool is ignored. If no one chose Need (either because no one is eligible or because the people who were eligible chose Greed instead), then it rolls between everyone in the Greed pool. So, in this way, if you're the only one in your party who could actually use a piece of loot, you're guaranteed to get it if you want it; if there are multiple people in your party who can use it and want it, the competition is limited only to that group, increasing your odds. Only when nobody needs an item does it become "free-for-all" loot.

    For the situation described in this thread, it would nearly eliminate the problem.

    And what's to stop people from always choosing "need"?
    The developers can define the criteria for what triggers the "need" option. At the very minimum, you can class-restrict it (so DPS/Tanks can't roll on Healer gear, etc.). But you could also restrict it by other criteria, such as if it's actually better, and so on -- up to the developers. In the end, even if someone who's the same class as you rolls for the loot when they don't truly "need" it, it's still better than potentially rolling against the whole group.
  • TWMagimayTWMagimay ✭✭✭✭✭
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    I've said it before and I'll say it again... the game needs a "need/greed" system, as they have in many other MMOs. It's a really simple solution that all-but-solved this problem a long time ago. Alas...

    This is probably an odd question but...how exactly does that work? It's one of those things everyone seems to have seen yet was never present in games I played(at least played to the point of caring about loot). While I understand the idea, the mechanics of it...can't quite seem to figure it out.

    Basically it just means that anyone who can actually use the item ("need") gets priority for that loot.

    If it's gear that you can actually use on your character, you have the "Need" option. Everybody has the "Greed" option (including those with "Need"). So, when it rolls, if one or more people chose Need, it rolls only between those people and the winner in the Need pool gets the loot; the Greed pool is ignored. If no one chose Need (either because no one is eligible or because the people who were eligible chose Greed instead), then it rolls between everyone in the Greed pool. So, in this way, if you're the only one in your party who could actually use a piece of loot, you're guaranteed to get it if you want it; if there are multiple people in your party who can use it and want it, the competition is limited only to that group, increasing your odds. Only when nobody needs an item does it become "free-for-all" loot.

    For the situation described in this thread, it would nearly eliminate the problem.

    And what's to stop people from always choosing "need"?
    The developers can define the criteria for what triggers the "need" option. At the very minimum, you can class-restrict it (so DPS/Tanks can't roll on Healer gear, etc.). But you could also restrict it by other criteria, such as if it's actually better, and so on -- up to the developers. In the end, even if someone who's the same class as you rolls for the loot when they don't truly "need" it, it's still better than potentially rolling against the whole group.

    We already have class-restriction by default though.
    I'm not sure Tera is set-up in a way that'd allow the game to scan your gear and determine if the dropped item is better or not(stat rolls and enchant levels come to mind). Plus, you can easily have a naked preset saved and swap to it before the rolling begins. Ilvl requirement wouldn't work for the same reason plus it'd be exceptionally useless when people are only missing a single item so they'd either not get need at all or it'd trigger on all items.
  • counterpointcounterpoint mod
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    TWMagimay wrote: »
    counterpoint wrote: »
    I've said it before and I'll say it again... the game needs a "need/greed" system, as they have in many other MMOs. It's a really simple solution that all-but-solved this problem a long time ago. Alas...

    This is probably an odd question but...how exactly does that work? It's one of those things everyone seems to have seen yet was never present in games I played(at least played to the point of caring about loot). While I understand the idea, the mechanics of it...can't quite seem to figure it out.

    Basically it just means that anyone who can actually use the item ("need") gets priority for that loot.

    If it's gear that you can actually use on your character, you have the "Need" option. Everybody has the "Greed" option (including those with "Need"). So, when it rolls, if one or more people chose Need, it rolls only between those people and the winner in the Need pool gets the loot; the Greed pool is ignored. If no one chose Need (either because no one is eligible or because the people who were eligible chose Greed instead), then it rolls between everyone in the Greed pool. So, in this way, if you're the only one in your party who could actually use a piece of loot, you're guaranteed to get it if you want it; if there are multiple people in your party who can use it and want it, the competition is limited only to that group, increasing your odds. Only when nobody needs an item does it become "free-for-all" loot.

    For the situation described in this thread, it would nearly eliminate the problem.

    And what's to stop people from always choosing "need"?
    The developers can define the criteria for what triggers the "need" option. At the very minimum, you can class-restrict it (so DPS/Tanks can't roll on Healer gear, etc.). But you could also restrict it by other criteria, such as if it's actually better, and so on -- up to the developers. In the end, even if someone who's the same class as you rolls for the loot when they don't truly "need" it, it's still better than potentially rolling against the whole group.

    We already have class-restriction by default though.
    I'm not sure Tera is set-up in a way that'd allow the game to scan your gear and determine if the dropped item is better or not(stat rolls and enchant levels come to mind). Plus, you can easily have a naked preset saved and swap to it before the rolling begins. Ilvl requirement wouldn't work for the same reason plus it'd be exceptionally useless when people are only missing a single item so they'd either not get need at all or it'd trigger on all items.

    Assuming the developers actually decided to work on this, these are all problems that could be overcome. Of course no system is perfect and you'll never absolutely prevent any case of "loot swiping", but you can alleviate the most egregious cases. It's a bit more tricky because these are smartboxes and not straight drops, but it could still be calculated.

    If it were me, I probably wouldn't have it drop a smartbox like this in the first place, but some sort of token system where everyone who participates gets tokens... but that's a different story.
  • TWMagimayTWMagimay ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2017
    counterpoint wrote: »

    Assuming the developers actually decided to work on this, these are all problems that could be overcome. Of course no system is perfect and you'll never absolutely prevent any case of "loot swiping", but you can alleviate the most egregious cases. It's a bit more tricky because these are smartboxes and not straight drops, but it could still be calculated.

    I'm not asking so you can give me some vague "It can totally work". I wanna know how you imagine such a system working in Tera, with all the various items it has. People keep doing this...give some supposedly great, all-problems-solved suggestions but when asked for details...they just wave a hand in the air and say "It'll work". Makes me think you have no idea if or how it could work but it's gotta cause you like the idea.

    PS: We also have a token system already for both low and mid-tier sets.
  • cloud3431cloud3431 ✭✭
    all this is, is some spoiled kid not getting what they want. it's been done before. if you're looking for guile and can't seem to win one in a roll, farm IoD for guile, not that hard. stop whining and move on. if nothing's reserved beforehand, everybody has the right to roll on the stuff, even if they don't need it. i know being polite is the only argument, but come on, it's an mmorpg, don't expect anything better than people being trolls.
  • AulonAulon ✭✭✭✭
    The system in play though not perfect allows people to get gear rather easily. You can get tokens just by doing IoD and Celestial Arena, not stepping foot into a five man in which would completely gear you out in Guile. Think it is better to point these options out since they are there to help over come IMing with pugs. Also I like how people are rewarded by joining a guild and finding friends, one of the perks is not having to depend on IM.
  • CatservantCatservant ✭✭✭✭
    Dhrizzit wrote: »
    im leaving the game

    i have to go back to deutschland for some weeks, and present all my job to my boss

    maybe i come back in some months, and do a big p2w to recover my time while i wasn't playing

    bye

    ??? Well, good luck, of course. Sounds nerve wracking and I hope it all goes well for you, but announcing it here seems kind of out of left field...

    Safe travels.
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