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Paragon -> Valkyrie Wins [Updated]

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Comments

  • JBGamingJBGaming ✭✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Gaalrak wrote: »
    dcc0b2f6e1754392b22f5970c5861c71.png

    Noesis is referring to the Reservation name Event. Please read the entirety of the post.
  • kizzyfizzyzkizzyfizzyz ✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    Trying to be respectful here but that's completely false. I'm honestly curious what your translation team is up to, because "Paragon" has a ton of skills with DIRECT references to the moon. Like, direct as in it literally has the word "moon" in it. Not to mention all the moon glyphs that show up with using many of the class's skills.

    Honestly, I'm not expecting the name to change. After all, EME is known for making questionable decisions and staying silent about changing them again. In the past, you guys at EME said you'd take community opinion into account in the future. Evidently that's not going to be the case.
  • GaalrakGaalrak ✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Gaalrak wrote: »
    dcc0b2f6e1754392b22f5970c5861c71.png

    Noesis is referring to the Reservation name Event. Please read the entirety of the post.

    I did read the entirety of the post, you are misunderstanding mine. I was speaking about the irony of them choosing "Paragon" as the new class name, which on its own sounds pretty cool, being a model of excellence and everything. Yet it describes absolutely nothing about the class, and as evidenced by this entire post, people don't like it as a class name. While it is not within our power to force them to change it, we are free to put forth our opinion on it and hope they take it into consideration and rethink it.

    @RimbaldiOfTera I re-read my own post and I understand where the misunderstanding started, my apologies.
  • JBGamingJBGaming ✭✭✭
    Gaalrak wrote: »
    Gaalrak wrote: »
    dcc0b2f6e1754392b22f5970c5861c71.png

    Noesis is referring to the Reservation name Event. Please read the entirety of the post.

    I did read the entirety of the post, you are misunderstanding mine. I was speaking about the irony of them choosing "Paragon" as the new class name, which on its own sounds pretty cool, being a model of excellence and everything. Yet it describes absolutely nothing about the class, and as evidenced by this entire post, people don't like it as a class name. While it is not within our power to force them to change it, we are free to put forth our opinion on it and hope they take it into consideration and rethink it.

    Ok well, I apologize. You didn't seem clear enough to me. I agree it is kind of ironic then that we must choose a good name for our character and can't change it until after it comes out. but yet we don't have the option to decide as a whole what the name should be of the class, or even vote on it.

    I think this will be one of the things that will be ignored.

    One person did point out a good aspect behind the chose though. It think its more slang than anything. Paragon. We know what it means. Someone pointed out according to lore she was the best of her clan. So I think its slang to be using Paragon, Maybe she was the only one of the castanic race that could actually weld the pole as a weapon. Maybe that is why, Paragon. I have yet to see the Lore behind Paragon though.
  • Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    I believe the korean translation was Lunar Dancer or something similar, and many of the skills translated referenced the moon, so you would be false. However, EME has a history of coming up with strange skill names (Let me reference the Berserker skill 'Tackle') that don't fit the skill at all, so it would be entirely believable for EME to come up with new skill names that don't directly reference the moon at all so as to justify it.
  • Ginjitsu wrote: »
    FaytEsteem wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    Just to ask....what made the name "Paragon" come into mind then?

    https://forums.enmasse.com/tera/discussion/comment/117585/#Comment_117585

    Yeah I read that whole thing....but still, how does Paragon even relate to the class in a way?
  • VirtualONVirtualON ✭✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    Can you also shoot down the "Paragon" name because obviously everyone hates it. In fact i have never ever seen a class name that has so little to do with the class itself like "Paragon". It doesn't sound cool and it is absolutely generic. I swear the person who came up with Paragon never plays any games with classes.

    Remember Lucid/Tensus names? Everyone hated it. You promised you would take the community's opinions into account regarding future names. We could live with gear's names because it is only temporary. But the a class name is gonna stay. Why can't you do like RU Tera? Make a list of names and let your players vote for it.
  • ArnetraArnetra ✭✭✭
    This whining was probably inevitable with the amount of people who wanted an awful name like lunar dancer. Not a huge fan of "Paragon" but "Dancer" sounded bad, was unrelated, and doesn't fit thematically with the rest of the class names, don't know why anyone would expect them to use it.

    I think the bigger lore relation than this "best of her clan" crap was that this glaive-wielding castanic tribe were the only ones to help in some war or some [filtered] while the rest sat on their asses, at least from what I remember of the translation of the lore introduction for them. The "paragons" of the castanic race who helped in the war while the rest ERPed in Castanica at least fits the definition.

    I would have liked Glaiver, it's applicable and hard to argue with apart from being a bit boring.
  • MoonzieMoonzie
    edited March 2017
    Gonna ask this...

    Why are people freaking out over the classes name when the class name itself has has little impact, at all, on the actual gameplay of the character?
  • Idi0ticGeniusIdi0ticGenius ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    I'm sorry, but I am 100% sure that this class has several references to the moon. Let's start with the Official Developer's Note about this new class. Please read the translated version of official BHS developer's note:

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vHWmTaTjWIH054_u81Mw5gLxJRhQlgI5XHdhWSrOfhc/edit?usp=sharing

    Here, there have been several references to the moon for this class. Even using skills show Moon as well.

    Very first thing you notice is this line
    To emphasize on character skill traits, we’ve chosen the Moon as the concept.
    The moon brought the symbol of sharpness and coldness,
    and we’ve set the powerful final blow Lunar Scar and Blood Moon as the base concept.

    Moon was the very base concept for this class, thus leading to the choice of weapon being Glaive. Without the concept of moon in mind, this class would never have been created.
    In order to find the right weapon and motion, we’ve investigated and thought through carefully from Korean Woldo arts, 24 Martial Arts, Chinese Podao*Guandao arts, Japanese Naginata, etc.
    (We’ve even tried to mimic them with a large umbrella in empty meeting room too...)
    In the end, we decided on Glaives (to be exact with original text: Chinese Guandao) that focuses striking with large blade at the tip and swinging around spinning motion to attack, and a Leather armor to match the dextrous movements.

    Here, Woldo (월도; 月刀) literally means Moon Blade, which we can call it Crescent Blade. Podao (朴刀; Plain Blade) and Guandao(关刀 ; Blade of Guan Yu). Guandao is also called Crescent Moon Blade (偃月刀) and if you've read Romance of Three Kingdoms or seen any works related to it, you will never miss this weapon called Green Dragon Crescent Blade (青龍偃月刀). Notice that we see 月刀 again, which is Crescent Blade portion of the word, and like I said, this literally means Moon Blade. Guandao is famous enough to appear in several works aside from anything related to three kingdoms.

    And if people still don't understand why I called it Lunar Dancer, it's because they literally described it as one
    At last, a Castanic Female who cuts through enemies at melee range while gathering powers from moonlight to infuse on to their glaives, Lunar Dancer was born. Now we’ll go over more details about the traits that Lunar Dancer has.
    [...]
    There are other various attack motions other than wide swings, and her fluid like chain skills as she slices through her enemies,
    is almost as if she is dancing under the moonlight.

    A melee class that slices through enemies swiftly and elegantly with her weapon infused with the power of moonlight, almost as if she is dancing under moonlight.

    Again, BHS emphasizes their main concept of Moon.

    My translations are mostly rewritten word-for-word without much of modification to keep their original meanings. So "Lunar Dancer" is not simply a fan-made, but the combination of both concept and design that the developer had in mind. I respected the ideas and concepts so I tried to keep them at best of my abilities to translate.

    Also, majority of their skill names are based on Moon. I'll even specify what Chinese derived words they used for their names in parentheses, so see how many Moon (月) you find:

    I am giving you three different naming for them:
    1. Direct Translation
    2. Names for the skill icon in English given by BHS
    3. What Sam and I translated as

    Consecutive Hit Slash (連擊斬)- Combo - Combo Attack
    Dodge (回避) - Moon Shadow - Moon Shadow (it's basically evasive roll )
    Moonlight Resonance (月光의 孔明) - Moonlight Dash - Moonlight Burst
    Rise Hit Slash (昇擊斬) - Rising Shot - Skyward Slash
    Wind Slash (風斬) - Cross Way - Gale Slash
    Rupture Slash (破裂斬) - Burst - Piercing Moonlight
    Earth Hit Slash (地擊斬) - Cutting - Fracture
    Moon Wave Slash (月波斬) - Split - Moon Fang
    Moonlight Lunge (月光跳躍) - Dash Cut - Lunar Rush
    Rise Attack (起床攻擊) - Rising Attack - Retaliate
    Moonlight Gravity (月光의 引力)- Moon Gravity - Lunar Gravity
    Moonlight Blast (月光爆)- Throw Glaive - Lunar Crash
    Consecutive Spin Slash (連廻斬)- Helicopter Cuts - Rolling Moon
    Moonlight Follow (月光沿) - Moon Catch - Umbra Slash
    Soul Hit Slash (魂擊斬)- Fatal Shot - Soul Scythe
    True Moon Light (眞月明)- Moonlight - Gathering Moonlight
    Spin Wind Slash (旋風斬)- Twister - Typhoon
    New Moon: Moonlight Resonance (新月:月光의 孔明) - Crescent Cut - New Moon: Moonlight Burst
    Moonlight's Blessing (月光의 加護) - Moon Grace Buff - Moonlight Sanctuary
    Red Moon (赤月) - Red Moon - Blood Moon
    Full Moon (滿月) - Full Moon - Full Moon

    You may have noticed (明) this character has sun(日) and moon (月) together, creating Bright (明) since both sun and moon provides light to the word day and night.

    With the amount of "moon" present in the original text, (not counting 明), that's 11/21. At least half of their skills are based on moon.

    Also check out how some skill animation shows Moon:

    Moonlight Blast (月光爆)- Throw Glaive - Lunar Crash:
    59115c73a4c7492ab3633ab855c2d955.png

    Red Moon (赤月) - Red Moon - Blood Moon
    c1f9b3df5ae041adbca0fa87b2b49964.png

    There are several others where if you use Full moon, you will see that it draws ~8m radius sized moon on the ground, indicating the range of the attack (although, the attack still hits at around 10~12m).
  • Imprezive1Imprezive1 ✭✭
    edited March 2017
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1PDRPxgkFE8_DKApHjzZTDjZSa5ZGB9Ge3Bdixeq1h3k/edit#heading=h.rqfnqrt7nik8
    This translation of the skill set says other wise. and these come straight from KTera so please tell me where none of the direct reference comes from?
  • edited March 2017
    Didn't RU poll on it and ended up choosing Valkyrie? Why not we use Dragoon, a classic name that is known for those that wield glaives or spears and is known for jump based attacks? Valkyries are usually depicted having swords and shields...

  • neoakneoak ✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    I'm sorry, but I am 100% sure that this class has several references to the moon. Let's start with the Official Developer's Note about this new class. Please read the translated version of official BHS developer's note:

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1vHWmTaTjWIH054_u81Mw5gLxJRhQlgI5XHdhWSrOfhc/edit?usp=sharing

    Here, there have been several references to the moon for this class. Even using skills show Moon as well.

    Very first thing you notice is this line
    To emphasize on character skill traits, we’ve chosen the Moon as the concept.
    The moon brought the symbol of sharpness and coldness,
    and we’ve set the powerful final blow Lunar Scar and Blood Moon as the base concept.

    Moon was the very base concept for this class, thus leading to the choice of weapon being Glaive. Without the concept of moon in mind, this class would never have been created.
    In order to find the right weapon and motion, we’ve investigated and thought through carefully from Korean Woldo arts, 24 Martial Arts, Chinese Podao*Guandao arts, Japanese Naginata, etc.
    (We’ve even tried to mimic them with a large umbrella in empty meeting room too...)
    In the end, we decided on Glaives (to be exact with original text: Chinese Guandao) that focuses striking with large blade at the tip and swinging around spinning motion to attack, and a Leather armor to match the dextrous movements.

    Here, Woldo (월도; 月刀) literally means Moon Blade, which we can call it Crescent Blade. Podao (朴刀; Plain Blade) and Guandao(关刀 ; Blade of Guan Yu). Guandao is also called Crescent Moon Blade (偃月刀) and if you've read Romance of Three Kingdoms or seen any works related to it, you will never miss this weapon called Green Dragon Crescent Blade (青龍偃月刀). Notice that we see 月刀 again, which is Crescent Blade portion of the word, and like I said, this literally means Moon Blade. Guandao is famous enough to appear in several works aside from anything related to three kingdoms.

    And if people still don't understand why I called it Lunar Dancer, it's because they literally described it as one
    At last, a Castanic Female who cuts through enemies at melee range while gathering powers from moonlight to infuse on to their glaives, Lunar Dancer was born. Now we’ll go over more details about the traits that Lunar Dancer has.
    [...]
    There are other various attack motions other than wide swings, and her fluid like chain skills as she slices through her enemies,
    is almost as if she is dancing under the moonlight.

    A melee class that slices through enemies swiftly and elegantly with her weapon infused with the power of moonlight, almost as if she is dancing under moonlight.

    Again, BHS emphasizes their main concept of Moon.

    My translations are mostly rewritten word-for-word without much of modification to keep their original meanings. So "Lunar Dancer" is not simply a fan-made, but the combination of both concept and design that the developer had in mind. I respected the ideas and concepts so I tried to keep them at best of my abilities to translate.

    Also, majority of their skill names are based on Moon. I'll even specify what Chinese derived words they used for their names in parentheses, so see how many Moon (月) you find:

    I am giving you three different naming for them:
    1. Direct Translation
    2. Names for the skill icon in English given by BHS
    3. What Sam and I translated as

    Consecutive Hit Slash (連擊斬)- Combo - Combo Attack
    Dodge (回避) - Moon Shadow - Evasive Roll (though, Moon Shadow sounds pretty nice)
    Moonlight Resonance (月光의 孔明)- Moonlight Burst - Moonlight Dash
    Rise Hit Slash (昇擊斬) - Rising Shot - Skyward Slash
    Wind Slash (風斬) - Cross Way - Gale Slash
    Rupture Slash (破裂斬) - Burst - Piercing Moonlight
    Earth Hit Slash (地擊斬) - Cutting - Fracture
    Moon Wave Slash (月波斬) - Split - Moon Fang
    Moonlight Lunge (月光跳躍) - Dash Cut - Lunar Rush
    Rise Attack (起床攻擊) - Rising Attack - Retaliate
    Moonlight Gravity (月光의 引力)- Moon Gravity - Lunar Gravity
    Moonlight Blast (月光爆)- Throw Glaive - Lunar Crash
    Consecutive Spin Slash (連廻斬)- Helicopter Cuts - Rolling Moon
    Moonlight Follow (月光沿) - Moon Catch - Umbra Slash
    Soul Hit Slash (魂擊斬)- Fatal Shot - Soul Scythe
    True Moon Light (眞月明)- Moonlight - Gathering Moonlight
    Spin Wind Slash (旋風斬)- Twister - Typhoon
    New Moon: Moonlight Resonance (新月:月光의 孔明) - Crescent Cut - New Moon: Moonlight Burst
    Moonlight's Blessing (月光의 加護) - Moon Grace Buff - Moonlight Sanctuary
    Red Moon (赤月) - Red Moon - Blood Moon
    Full Moon (滿月) - Full Moon - Full Moon

    You may have noticed (明) this character has sun(日) and moon (月) together, creating Bright (明) since both sun and moon provides light to the word day and night.

    With the amount of "moon" present in the original text, (not counting 明), that's 11/21. At least half of their skills are based on moon.

    Also check out how some skill animation shows Moon:

    Moonlight Blast (月光爆)- Throw Glaive - Lunar Crash:
    59115c73a4c7492ab3633ab855c2d955.png

    Red Moon (赤月) - Red Moon - Blood Moon
    c1f9b3df5ae041adbca0fa87b2b49964.png

    There are several others where if you use Full moon, you will see that it draws ~8m radius sized moon on the ground, indicating the range of the attack (although, the attack still hits at around 10~12m).

    A7DgRmpCYAAsJvd.jpg
  • vkobevkobe ✭✭✭✭✭
    VirtualON wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    kamalr wrote: »
    'Moonlight Warrior'/'Lunar Dancer' were good names because they at least referenced their moon-based abilities, and what they do in combat.

    Not to shoot down anyone's suggestions, but as far as I've seen none of the class moves have a direct reference to a moon in their appearance.

    Can you also shoot down the "Paragon" name because obviously everyone hates it. In fact i have never ever seen a class name that has so little to do with the class itself like "Paragon". It doesn't sound cool and it is absolutely generic. I swear the person who came up with Paragon never plays any games with classes.

    obviously you never play guild war :3

    https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Paragon
This discussion has been closed.