[TERA PC & Console] En Masse is closing, but TERA lives on! We will continue to support TERA PC (NA) and TERA Console until service is transferred. Stay tuned for more information.
[TERA Console] The Grotto of Lost Souls update (v85) is now live! Read the patch notes here: https://bit.ly/TERACon_v85
[TERA PC] The 64-bit update (v97) is now live. Check out all the changes delivered on August 11 here: https://bit.ly/tera64_patchnotes
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Comments
Do you know what a ToS is? This is an agreement that you enter willingly into, y'know. Pretty sure we as players aren't supposed to mess with the Tera code, so your argument is invalid.
Out of all the crap here this sounds by far the most reasonable solution to all this. That way, when it's downright outside of whatever's in this subforum, you can go ahead and drop the hammer on their head no question. I mean, even a detailed, thorough, unbiased conversation with the people who make them would make a huge difference.
Also, having the devs who actually made these programs at your side would help you weed out the actual offenders since you will have their counsel. In turn, they could help you be enlightened as to how these programs work, what's within both legal and ethical line and what's not, and be actually there to help you identify those who use it to abuse.
I'm sure this will be a huge thing to do to move forward and would probably cause some huge waves (eg. legal stuff and/or approval from BHS), but, like someone said, this is just our game as it is yours. Come on, it's 2017 - everything should be progressive.
DPS meters:
First it wasn't a policy, they let it slide as long as it wasn't used to harass other people about their DPS, it was always against the TOS they just happen to let people use it, and now they don't. Why? I don't know, but I would reckon that with the pop up of a certain website that keeps a record of the DPS that your particular character does when you happen to run with any of these players that run that particular program, your DPS is up for show without your consent and could potentially lead to you being harassed or just not picked to run dungeons from LFG's if they decide to look you up on that certain website.
Packet Forwarding Proxy Servers:
Except that the program that people are using are not just for ping dependent skills, they use them to instant cast multi hit skills in a fraction of a second. You can argue that it's a "soft fix" for people with ping issues but it's not the case here, people with low ping are using it, because it gives that much of an advantage in dps and it's used in conjunction with DPS meter. The top guilds of most servers almost all use the injector they (to my experience) encourage other people that they play with on a regular basis to download and use it.
S1 Modifications:
It sucks to suck, if your computer can't run the game at its lowest settings perhaps its time to get a new one, you agree in the TOS that modifying any of the game's content or files can potentially get you banned. For me personally, I've seen countless people say they have FPS problems, sudden dips in FPS while I've never had any myself - maybe I'm lucky? But I don't think that the issue is that the game runs THAT poorly it's just players not wanting to recognize that they have a outdated machine and its time to change rigs or perhaps it's just that you need to clean it out because it's over heating and throttling your performance.
gpk Modifications:
Harmful? Yes, not even questionable. People who use gpk mods to change how their outfits would look directly impact profits, you can say "well they probably wouldn't have spent money to buy cosmetic items to begin with" sure that is valid but its also equally as valid to say the next person who would have spent money to buy cosmetic items, but then found out (or were told) they don't have to because they can just download and replace the gpk files to make their character look like it had the premium outfits. It's harder to say because it differs from individual to individual but it's without a doubt that they do harm.
No, because moving closer to the server isn't the same as downloading a software that impacts how the game plays and being closer to the servers doesn't mean you're going to magically do drastically more DPS.
Yes, server lag is a problem, yes it does suck to one day have ping of 150+ but guess what, br's play the game with 200+ ping all the time and they can clear content, why can't you or any other person with sub 100 or less ping.
No need to mess with Tera code if Enmasse can properly code themselves ^^
How is it racist tho? Did I offend you or any other race? Just analyze the situation properly from EME's pov, and then from BHS pov. It's not RACIST to accept the FACT that anyone outside of NA will have, by definition, high ping.
@Johngaloria Enmasse doesn't code the game. BHS does. Are you even aware of this?
Wonderful day we're having
these servers really don't lag at all, geez I wonder if they can fix it one day so this doesn't happen
I don't know if this post will be deleted or not, and I'll try to keep it as 'vague' as possible so people who don't know, can't search for it.
I am by no means experts in that program, I am just saying what I have learned, and I won't explain in depth either, just simplifying it.
This will be a SUPER long post.
There is a reason why some people created that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program, TERA, being a 'real time combat' orientated game, is ping dependent, and as 'damage average calculator' becomes increasingly popular, some of the player's enjoyment focus would change from clearing instances, to comparing their 'scores'.
And as TERA gets more competitive in endgame, high ping players suffers in name calling because of ping tax.
Some people would call them bad, some would even label them as trash, shunning them, avoiding them, or even blocking them.
Now, some might argue that 'lol what era is this now? people still saying ping matters? git gud scrub'
Here is an example of how Tera combat system works,
Single Cast Skill (Example: Slayer's Measured Slice):
Press button for Measured Slice > Delay > Character uses Measured Slice
Using Single Cast Skills back-to-back(Example: Eviscerate to Measured Slice):
Press button for Eviscerate > Delay > Character uses Eviscerate > Press button for Measured Slice > Delay > Character uses Measured Slice
Using Channeling Skills (Example: Burst Fire, Burning Heart)
Hold down button for Burst Fire > Delay > Burst Fire first cast > Delay > Burst Fire second cast > Delay > Burst Fire third cast > Delay > Burst Fire fourth cast > you get the story.
Even charging skills like Thunder Strike and Radiant Arrow suffers from ping tax during every charge.
High Ping Players don't just suffer from skill delays, they suffer from hit delay too,
If there are and fast attacks, depending on your ping, you might even get hit the moment bosses starts to do attack animation.
I will use SKY CRUISER ENDEAVOR's Putrion as Example:
Boss' starts to prepare stun > Boss starts to fly up > AOE appears > Stunned
But since the animation is 1 second or lesser,
This is what high ping players gets
Boss' starts to prepare stun > Boss starts to fly up > Stunned
There are many other examples but i'll just list Putrion's.
And with that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program, high ping players can somewhat negates the delays for skills.
This is how that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program works:
Single Cast Skill (Example: Slayer's Measured Slice):
Press button for Measured Slice > Delay > Character uses Measured Slice
Using Single Cast Skills back-to-back(Example: Eviscerate to Measured Slice):
Press button for Eviscerate > Delay > Character uses Eviscerate > Press button for Measured Slice > Character uses Measured Slice
Using Channeling Skills (Example: Burst Fire, Burning Heart)
Hold down button for Burst Fire > Delay > Burst Fire first cast > Burst Fire second cast > Burst Fire third cast > Burst Fire fourth cast > you get the story.
And yes, that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program removes the subsequent delay for skill chaining, making your skills 'hit as fast as 0 ping'
And some people might then think, 'Hey 0 ping, that's unfair, even the people living in Chicago gets like 8 ping to 18 ping, not 0!'
Well, 100 ping delay = 0.1 second delay, so a 10 ping difference compared to a 0 ping is 0.01 second.
The advantages of that program gives to people who lives in Chicago is that much.
Now, there are 3 well known Devs who are related to that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program, and all three of them got banned,
Dev B, Dev M, and Dev P.
Dev M created that program, but he did not share it with anybody outside of his friend circle,and kept it a secret, hence for many years, only did he get 'found out' recently.
Dev B created that program, and sold it for gold(not going to mention how much), but he did not spread it to many people too.
Dev P created that program, and shared it to almost anybody for free.
Some of you who thinks it is unfair, is it really unfair if Dev P openly shares it so anybody can get it?
I believe EME knows about it at this point in time, and since they do know it helps players who have high ping to play on equal with people who lives in/near Chicago, they allow it silently, which makes this a 'Grey Zone'
Grey Zone is not black and white, it is '3rd party' but since it do no harm, it is allowed silently,
'damage average calculator' is one famous/popular example of something which is in the Grey Zone.
And since that program is an open source program, other people who knows coding, could use it for exploit,
the famous one is the one which is related to ruinous manor, where others can go pass the gate after first boss, and effectively skipping first boss.
Effectively moving this program from grey zone into black zone.
And then there comes a problem, where this unknown person, used ANOTHER 'thou-shalt-not-named' program, which is not even related, or close to what Devs B, M, and P made, to exploit Tera Reward System.
And this effectively made EME start all these 'Witch Hunts'.
Some of you might feel that 'hey this is NA server, go back to whatever region you are from if you want to complain about all these unfairness',
Let me tell you, not only does Europeans plays NA server, other regions like South East Asia plays NA servers too.
And South East Asia is a region with many different languages, and different countries, the currently publishers who are in SEA regions are
Taiwan, Japan, and Korea, which you HAVE to know Chinese, Japanese, or Koreans.
If you don't know any of these three languages, you won't be able to play.
And now think,
If everybody who is not living in NA, stops playing TERA as you wished, would you be able to see a 'lively server filled with people'?
And since every non-NA people left, there will be lesser people playing, and the price for tradable items would increase, are you fine with that?
And what about your in-game friends, are you sure all of your in-game friends, even close ones, are from NA?
And let's face it, the world is about money, since every non-NA people left, EME would definitely lose a portion of their revenue, and if they can't make decent profit, what do you think they would do?
If you are in their shoes, would you continue a business where you earn little money?
And from what I see from both sides, the only communication mentioned is 'random stranger whispering dev M, and dev M thought that random stranger is going to find evidence and report dev M for 3rd party program'
And I really do pity Spacecats for being the target of frustration and rage just because he is Community Manager, because of what EME did,
for those who don't know, it takes more than one person to make a decision, and a superior to make hard decisions.
To EME, not just Spacecats:
I know that '3rd party programs' are not allowed, and to EME, if you really want proof of benefits of high ping players using that 'thou-shalt-not-named' program, I'm pretty sure a lot of people would gladly take videos and show you the difference, I believe Dev B even has videos about it.
And could you give the Devs one more chance, and communicate with them? I feel that, banning them just because of a 'failed communication' seems really unfair to them, and ultimately, what they did really did benefit a lot of players, numbering in the thousands.(there are proof of this as well)
And if you want their direct contact, I'm pretty sure there will be a few who would instantly tell you about it, heck, if you send me a whisper, I would even tell you about their contact in a Messenger Chat Application.
Ok now, Check box time,
I hope this clarifies on how that program works, and why people uses it.
While maybe he didn't pick the best words, he's not completely wrong, my friends and I play from Latin America (2 of us from Mex. and the rest from South America) we know we won't ever have a decent ping no matter what, yet we play, spend EMP and time, it's our choice, and if the latency was unbearable we would simply play some other thing. However, that doesn't mean there aren't network and optimization problems BHS and EME should take care of, I sincerely hope this incident, which could lead to very, very bad press for the game if the community wants to, forces both companies to take action and solve the issues discussed here. Meanwhile, cheat engine and injectors should remain forbidden.
Are you telling me that this build (1) is not sufficient to play TERA and I should spend loads upgrading it because the TERA code is badly/not optimised? You know this thing runs FF XIV on max settings just fine. It runs Tom Clancy's The Division on max settings just fine. I've done system tests which indicate that it should do VR with the Rift and Vive just fine.
So explain to me why TERA doesn't run properly at anything close to Preset 4 without losing FPS left right and center.
(1) Yes, this the actual parts list my friend built for me.
I agree with this and I'm sure the developers of programs would have been fine with having discussions and working for a collaboration if they 1. didn't get a [filtered] poor attempt at contact and 2. weren't scared of being banned (and then got banned anyway). I'm pretty sure we all would have been much happier in the long run with this method if we could have had it, but EME sort of tossed that option out the window with their harsh decisions and actions.
I'll take up the role then even tho I'm somehow a spectator:
We've seen the b-utt allready let's not pretend we don't know what's under that skirt. The name of the program Tewii mentioned is the injector. We all know it let's not hide. Now regarding the statement that it just "unbreaks" the game, by removing unnecessary delays, is basically describing the technical workings of the program itself. I'll not enter into bigger details on how it works, but the fact is, that when you know how the program works, as in, you've been in touch with the mechanics of the program or downright the code of it, you don't need to be a BHS programmer to see how your side of the thing works.
That is what seems to be missing from Spacecats' view, the deeper workings of the 3rd party tools used and how far they affect what. I don't know if he either doesn't know how it technically works or if he's just hiding the things like we didn't see the b-utt under that skirt already. Point in case is, the real deal about those injectors is not faking your DPS as is suggested, it's just fixing the issue with it to begin with.
Correct me if I'm wrong on the matter, but the program that is the topic is pretty obvious to me at least.
I'm not gonna say that it's impossible to fake the DPS on the server, like finding some exploit to go 100% crits or faking the power or anything like this, if this is the case and it's found, then yes ban on sight the hacker no questions asked. But the injectors are a different deal.
There isn't enough technical evidence that it will either avoid or cause a DDoS type of command from the client, some players say it will by it's nature, some say it's nature fixes the possibility of the official client creating one under high ping. That's a matter for a deeper test.
To be really fair, guys, create a goddemn test server again with client enabled injectors always on, and test the effects on client and server. If it fixes our issues and won't cause new (big) ones then apply it! There's many stuff the community has developed that could very well be used in the game natively but well, we're not the official devs so we can't.
Enmasse can implement the proxy injector themselves within their client. [edited]
So, European here. From Denmark to be more specific.
It's funny you say all this when most of the people I see actually complaining about awful latency are from America. In a lot of cases I play with better and more stable ping than Americans, and a lot of the time it seems to be only just barely better for those that live over there. People with a consistent sub-40 ms ping are few and far between, even looking at Americans playing on a server located wherever in NA, because it just so happens that America's infrastructure as far as internet goes is terrible. And TERA's server(s) seem to be in a... Let's say not particularly great datacenter that has bloody weather issues seemingly affecting its performance.
That said, dear EME: You should consider relocating your server(s) to Austria, Netherlands, or Germany. Yes, servers located in Europe for an NA game, you heard that right. It would 1) improve the latency for a lot of Americans, 2) not change anything for most others, and 3) worst case the currently lucky few that get 20-40ms might get 60-80ms instead. We have great datacenters with great networks over here.
Or the mentioned before an approved list of modifications that help in the performance of the game.
You are a war hero, couldnt say anything better or clarify anything better, my most honest bow for you, thanks!