Hackers in TERA

Vindicting · August 2017

clfarron4 wrote: »

Vindicting wrote: »

FernetDoble wrote: »

Tbh, this game deserves to die. Players got sick of waiting for BHS to fix [filtered], they saw their chance to fix it themself and took it. For YEARS ppl asked optimization to BHS. What did they give us? Nothing. Now there is a Noc lag fix, FPS utility/modifications of s1 engine, and even a mod that forces the UI to be processed by the GPU instead of CPU ( bc aparently the option was there, but never enabled). For years players asked BHS to fix ping reliable skills such as Burst fire, Rapid fire and chains (with more than 200ms, u cant chain spring atack, blade draw or Sundering/shadow burst). Now there is a fix called SP.
Are you really that surprised that ppl took the matter in their own hands?.
If ppl were able to fix the game as a hobby, BHS could have done it, but they didnt give a [filtered]. Thats why this game deserves to die.
The pandora's box has been opened, security updates wont do anything. Stop wasting time talking about if proxy is good or bad and start looking for a solution, bc proxy isnt going anywhere, like it or not.
Also, yea, this post is agains rules of forums and will get closed.

This is what I don't understand, people keep blaming but nobody is looking for solutions. And all the forum whiteknights like counterpoint and ElinUsagi don't even understand basic computer networking. They still somehow manage to be so arrogant and assume they are right despite being told they are wrong by knowledgeable people who have feats to back their claims up.

From what I understand, some of the mass usage of certain programs, which can be used malicious to exploit the game, started out of a means to fix some skill fundamental to their class, which then developed into what we see today.

Back in April, I made a suggestion to address this very issue, but it was brushed off by EME staff. I have since tried again to make this suggestion with no response, and I have a thread in Game Suggestions.

I've also tried getting other related discussions going for PvE and PvP content, with the goal of discussion what breaks with each class in the hope that other potential modifications come out of it to further reduce the need for third party programs, but no-one particularly seems to want to discuss it on here.

I further referenced my suggestion on the Player Council Discord, only to have it brushed off with the "it's BHS" by a PC member, which made me feel like no-one there wants to know about suggestions for fixing the game.

I've also made a support ticket, just so I can make my suggestions, even though there is no actual place for suggesting technical solutions to the game.

Yes, my suggestion is one of those "difficult" fixes that requires a lot of work to be done, but at this point, we are well beyond the point where plaster-patches will both fix the issue and de-incentivise players to use 3-rd party programs to do what BHS hasn't done and an actual difficult fix is needed.

I had a lot of fun reading what Meishu and Bernkastel wrote during that time. You guys all tried very hard in trying to help EME but they were just too egoistic and stubborn to accept what they had to do because that would prove that they know less about their game than players.

clfarron4 · August 2017

CassandraTR wrote: »

Secondly,

clfarron4 wrote: »

Bunch of meaningless drivel.

You keep bringing up how EME can fix the code, change the skill, do a revamp for multi-hit or charging skills to address ping, etc.... How many times do we have to say... EME can't do that. Only BHS can. Until you get that in your head, you're going to keep saying all of these pipe dreams. The player council discord?? Do you think BHS even gives a flip about that?

EME is the publisher and distributor for NA. Not the developer. 5 years after TERA's release and you still can't figure that out.

EU TERA implemented fixes to memeslash independently of BHS, and JTERA mod the hell out of their client (but JTERA are, in sorts, the lead developers of JTERA of all content that isn't in the stock build). Heck, BHS actually take stuff from the JTERA build because they like it. If they can do it, then why can't EME?

66ECX7NAN7 · August 2017

Because it costs money and EME is too cheap to even have decent servers.

Spacecats · August 2017

KnightsReprise wrote: »

Well, great first memeslash and now this how much longer will they keep making stupid mistakes and destroying this game piece by piece I don't get it. Back in 2012-2016 there were not as many people exploiting the game as they are now. If they did exploit they were hidden under ground where the light did not shine out of fear of retribution of getting banned or facing the wrath of the mighty Tonka or the Treeshark.

Tonka and Treeshark weren't responsible for banning anyone. The team that handles this has remained relatively the same, and they continue to ban people. The only difference is that there are more programmers out there with a lot of time on their hands.

But these days now in 2017 hackers and proxy players will openly admit "yeah I'm hacking/using proxy deal with it. " then expect no consquence to be given or any at all. They will find new ways to exploit while you're trying to fix the old ways and always find a way around it. Not just a select few though with skill but anyone who knows how to do this.

Every online game gets hacked, then the devs fix it, then the hackers find a way to hack again, and then the developers fix it. That's not an excuse, just a reality of online games. If players want to help, they can report players they see hacking and send any information about the hack with their ticket. We pass that on to Bluehole so that the next wave of hacks can be stopped.

Idk what happened or how you guys let Tera fall to such a state of decay enmasse/BHS. but you need to get your [filtered] in gear and start shorting this out lest we be over run by hackers exploiters 24/7. and your game becomes nothing but a dead waste land of toxic players. now mixed in with the crowd of exploiters to terrible or too lazy to progress in any other way but cheating.

I know it seems like that when everyone is talking about hackers. The problem is that many players out there actively give these hackers attention. The very people writing scripts that you're angry about, who have been repeatedly banned, get regular player support. Some even pay money, supporting these hackers. We acknowledge it's a bad situation, and we're hoping the honest players out there can help. We acknowledge that it's an issue and that these hacks need to stop. I know creating a support ticket is way more boring than posting despair in the forums, but threads like these do nothing to combat hacks. (Also a reminder here, don't call people out in the forums. Make the ticket, give us their name there, and our customer support team will investigate/ban where appropriate).

ZingoPingo · August 2017

Vindicting wrote: »

If EME was dumb they would:
1. Think banning 1% of memeslashers would do anything.
2. Think that not communicating with devs and community would be good thing.
3. Create a lot of drama and official posts about security fixes then get destroyed by third party devs.
4. Make fake security updates that don't do anything except incentivize normal players to hack by introducing mere inconvenience.

1. ALL the memeslashers I've (and my guild) have reported are permabanned. As well as their entire party.
2. Maybe the third-party devs could have contacted EME before publicly releasing the proxy and the 50+ mods?
3. Only drama is people complaining their precious proxy is weakened.
4. What's fake about the security updates? It did hinder proxy and all the modules (your god Pinkie said so himself). Granted it's not a permanent fix.

Vindicting wrote: »

Also by donating money to proxy devs I mean Pinkie Pie received over $600 on the first day more than he ever had thanks to EME security update. I even saw them joke on Discord about how EME should do this more so more people will donate.

Oooo razzle dazzle 600 fine American dollars!! EME unban Pinkie and hire the guy. Rolls in deep profit on a broken program.

Vindicting wrote: »

I am saying EME is very simple-minded like you

ME ZING
ME LIKE PVP
ME LIKE NO CHEATING

Spacecats · August 2017

Vindicting wrote: »

KnightsReprise wrote: »

...also vindicting people know how to proxy and such it's not hard and you need to stop perpetuating this I'm sure they know the games going to die soon if they don't fix it multiple threads will not solve this.

No too long has the forum been completely detached from what's actually happening. The forum is an echo chamber and only get info months after it appears on Discord and days after it appears on reddit. We need to let EME understand the gravity of this situation and not just live in the forum echo chamber where news is slow and whiteknights are the norm.

Trust me, we're not just reading forums all day. We talk to folks in-game, in multiple Discord servers, in Player Council, and in our Twitch chat. In fact we just started a new EME Discord where players can talk about TERA without the fear of constant proxy chatter, hate speech, or harassment for disagreeing with people. Come hang out with us: https://discord.gg/MthDMfX

Vindicting · August 2017

GlitterBalloon wrote: »

Vindicting wrote: »

If EME was dumb they would:
1. Think banning 1% of memeslashers would do anything.
2. Think that not communicating with devs and community would be good thing.
3. Create a lot of drama and official posts about security fixes then get destroyed by third party devs.
4. Make fake security updates that don't do anything except incentivize normal players to hack by introducing mere inconvenience.

1. ALL the memeslashers I've (and my guild) have reported are permabanned. As well as their entire party.
2. Maybe the third-party devs could have contacted EME before publicly releasing the proxy and the 50+ mods?
3. Only drama is people complaining their precious proxy is weakened.
4. What's fake about the security updates? It did hinder proxy and all the modules (your god Pinkie said so himself). Granted it's not a permanent fix.

Vindicting wrote: »

Also by donating money to proxy devs I mean Pinkie Pie received over $600 on the first day more than he ever had thanks to EME security update. I even saw them joke on Discord about how EME should do this more so more people will donate.

Oooo razzle dazzle 600 fine American dollars!! EME unban Pinkie and hire the guy. Rolls in deep profit on a broken program.

Vindicting wrote: »

I am saying EME is very simple-minded like you

ME ZING
ME LIKE PVP
ME LIKE NO CHEATING

1. I don't know but on Discord I see people using it everyday.
2. As far as I know from reading reddit back in that period they did and EME ignored them. I think meishu actually sent in tickets a very long time ago from what she said on her blog.
3. Any conflict is drama. Drama is bad for EME.
4. As far as I know all the modules are working again, so it did hinder for about a day?

I don't really understand what you're trying to say but it's not working. They need better solutions.

Vindicting · August 2017

Spacecats wrote: »

Vindicting wrote: »

KnightsReprise wrote: »

...also vindicting people know how to proxy and such it's not hard and you need to stop perpetuating this I'm sure they know the games going to die soon if they don't fix it multiple threads will not solve this.

No too long has the forum been completely detached from what's actually happening. The forum is an echo chamber and only get info months after it appears on Discord and days after it appears on reddit. We need to let EME understand the gravity of this situation and not just live in the forum echo chamber where news is slow and whiteknights are the norm.

Trust me, we're not just reading forums all day. We talk to folks in-game, in multiple Discord servers, in Player Council, and in our Twitch chat. In fact we just started a new EME Discord where players can talk about TERA without the fear of constant proxy chatter, hate speech, or harassment for disagreeing with people. Come hang out with us: https://discord.gg/MthDMfX

I will join and check it out at some point, thanks for the heads up.

I know you guys have a lot on your plates now but I think the issue is you simply don't communicate with knowledgeable users. Everyday the unofficial Discords the proxy devs and moderators just talk about how uninformed most people on the Player Council is regarding this issue and like just today counterpoint was embarrassing himself with horrible computer knowledge.

Talking to players about how they feel about an issue is very important, but it is even more important to get the opinion of experts. And I don't think you have spoken to people the community considers experts on the subject.

Spacecats · August 2017

CassandraTR wrote: »

First off,

Vindicting wrote: »

2. Communicate with proxy devs and community.

You are out of your flippin mind if you think a game company has to communicate with anyone who has created a tool/utility/program/api/whatever that breaks their own terms of service, especially when their official policy is NO add-ons and they have no formal add on/mod support. Just because blizzard chose to do it doesn't mean any other company has to, nor does it mean it is financially feasible for a game that has such a different population from the largest mmo ever created.

I'm not even going do address "fix the packets." You have a clear misunderstanding of how a computer works if you think it is not a simple task to identify and view packets from anything sent to your machines. There's freaking FAQs on Microsoft's website for crying out loud.

It's not unheard of, especially when it comes to a game developer. We're the publisher, so mostly we pass on information to the devs in Korea. I know the narrative a lot of hackers out there try to spread around is "I tried really hard to help them, but now I HAVE TO HACK!"

We have gotten no such offers. The e-mail is Community(at)enmasse(dot)com. It's public knowledge. Anyone who is smart enough to hack the client is smart enough to e-mail that address. They'd rather tell players that they took the high road than actually attempt to help. And no, responding to a customer support ban notice for hacking with "if you unban me, I'll solve all your problems" doesn't count as an offer to help.

Secondly,

clfarron4 wrote: »

Bunch of meaningless drivel.

You keep bringing up how EME can fix the code, change the skill, do a revamp for multi-hit or charging skills to address ping, etc.... How many times do we have to say... EME can't do that. Only BHS can. Until you get that in your head, you're going to keep saying all of these pipe dreams. The player council discord?? Do you think BHS even gives a flip about that?

EME is the publisher and distributor for NA. Not the developer. 5 years after TERA's release and you still can't figure that out.

Well you're right BHS is the one that develops hotfixes to stop hacks... but... I mean... you could be a little more polite about saying it

Spacecats · August 2017

EDIT - Changed thread title from "the situation is dire" to something... slightly less click-baitey.

xoBarb · August 2017

Spacecats wrote: »

The only difference is that there are more programmers out there with a lot of time on their hands.

Anyone else volunteer to be a referral for these proxy devs resume so they can get out and focus on a real job instead of a game they're banned from?

Vindicting · August 2017

xoBarb wrote: »

Spacecats wrote: »

The only difference is that there are more programmers out there with a lot of time on their hands.

Anyone else volunteer to be a referral for these proxy devs resume so they can get out and focus on a real job instead of a game they're banned from?

From what I read on Discord they're all doing this part time. These mods are anything from PhD students to medical doctors, and Meishu even works at Discord.

Spacecats · August 2017

Vindicting wrote: »

xoBarb wrote: »

Spacecats wrote: »

The only difference is that there are more programmers out there with a lot of time on their hands.

Anyone else volunteer to be a referral for these proxy devs resume so they can get out and focus on a real job instead of a game they're banned from?

From what I read on Discord they're all doing this part time. These mods are anything from PhD students to medical doctors, and Meishu even works at Discord.

Ah... I'd rather not comment except... nah. A medical doctor is not taking time out of their day to hack a free to play video game. Hackers can say they're Nobel prize winners. It doesn't make their hobby any more legit.

ZingoPingo · August 2017

I guess I'm using my CS degree incorrectly. Pinkie made $600 in ONE DAY!!!

clfarron4 · August 2017

Spacecats wrote: »

\We have gotten no such offers. The e-mail is Community(at)enmasse(dot)com. It's public knowledge.

@Spacecats Wait, so you're telling me that making the suggestions in the Forums, Filing Support Tickets and Posting in Game Suggestions is not the correct way to contact En Masse Entertainment to share highly technical fixes to improve the TERA experience, but an e-mail address which is listed on a page that I would not associate with submitting such type of suggestions?

I can say that I certainly did not associate that page with suggesting highly technical fixes.

Okay.

Hackers in TERA

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