There will be a TERA PC Maintenance on Thursday (7/19) from 7 - 11 A.M. PDT

Availability of deleted items: I think we waited long enough already.

This is a thread directed to EME and what do they plan on doing about the following items:

- Dragon Fireworks
- Quarter Day signs
- Half Day signs

As you may remember, these items are currently in game, but only a small portion of players have them, a small portion that was online and bought them in massive amounts, before another part of the playerbase decided it was a good idea to spam the fireworks purposely to make everyone else clients crash, and spam profanity in the signs all over velika, Causing these 3 items to be removed 5 minutes after their introduction, leaving a very large portion of the playerbase, without access to them.

It has been around 3 years already. Don't You guys at EME think we waited long enough already? Or are we still paying the price because of the "good idea" that some idiots had at that moment?

As far as the Dragon Firework goes, i remember a fix was implemented to it: Upon use, it would put all fireworks, including the Dragon firework, in a 1 hour Cooldown, this was made in order to avoid spamming, and some months after the fireworks got removed.

A word filter was applied to the signs, but players managed to bypass it, causing them to be removed a 2nd time, leaving once again, a vast majority of players that wanted the signs to use them properly, without access to them.

I will not accept an answer such as "We need to run technical tests on this items" Because there isnt any need for them. All you gotta do is apply a long CD on the fireworks to avoid spam, and use the old system of the campfires, so that the signs cannot be placed too close from each other. I doubt using a much harsher word filter is anything difficult with your tools.

"Innocent pay for the guilty" Is the proverb that applies here. We honest players are paying the price of not being able to get this items at all, because some idiots decided to use said items in the wrong way. Instead of dealing properly with the case, EME decided it was better to remove them entirely from the game, with no ways of getting them for the past 3 years. The easy solution.

Its time EME. There were a lot of suggestions about how to make this items available again, putting em in the Federation bills, Fashion Coupons, rep merchants, VG quest, etc, all of the suggestions were ignored over the years. Its 2018, please, make this items available once again for those who never even got the chance to get them for the actions of a brain dead minority.

PS: Speaking of campfires, is there any way you could ask BHS, to let us use campfires as something like a drop item? One of my favorite campfires, the Santa Candle, is so festive and yet i wasnt able to drop one during Christmas, which made me sad. Please, let em know we would like to just use it the same way you use stuff like the Sand Castles or the Disco Ball.
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Comments

  • allofspaceandtimeallofspaceandtime ✭✭✭✭✭
    I still have over 1k dragon fireworks on av. maybe someday I will sell them
  • counterpointcounterpoint ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 6
    Rather than getting so indignant about not having them, it would probably be more convincing (particularly for signs) if you'd make the case on why it's so beneficial to the game to have it. I think they just decided it wasn't worth the hassle, and I'm not sure the argument here is that convincing. How has not having these things harmed the game? How would the game be better with these things enabled?

    And let's not pretend: no amount of word filter is going to solve the sign moderation problem. People will immediately find a way around it, and make a game of doing so. Maybe it's worth dealing with the moderation problem anyway, but that's why I'd focus on making the case for the good use of signs (so they can be convinced it's worth the hassle).

    Finally, with all the things going on right now, I'm not sure it is the time, but obviously that (like all of this) is up to them.
  • HLK76PFWXTHLK76PFWXT ✭✭✭
    How much i remember spaming dragon fireworks during alliance conflict when the enemy was rushing to our fort... one way of defending the fort from invaders for sure ^_^


    And on EU at least i have seen those signs all over with buddy up codes or guilds recruiting so they might have their use at least on that region with the overwhelming population.. but i am not sure about NA...
  • ElinUsagiElinUsagi ✭✭✭✭✭
    Margarethe wrote: »
    If they really cared about that, they'd have blocked the item from use.

    Yes, they should have done that also.

    If the main issue is how players were making use of them then better they should have blocked those items from use. A more ethical way would be to ban those who abused those items (quarter signs expecially).
  • > @counterpoint said:
    > Rather than getting so indignant about not having them, it would probably be more convincing (particularly for signs) if you'd make the case on why it's so beneficial to the game to have it. I think they just decided it wasn't worth the hassle, and I'm not sure the argument here is that convincing. How has not having these things harmed the game? How would the game be better with these things enabled?
    >
    > And let's not pretend: no amount of word filter is going to solve the sign moderation problem. People will immediately find a way around it, and make a game of doing so. Maybe it's worth dealing with the moderation problem anyway, but that's why I'd focus on making the case for the good use of signs (so they can be convinced it's worth the hassle).
    >
    > Finally, with all the things going on right now, I'm not sure it is the time, but obviously that (like all of this) is up to them.

    Sad to Say that, from what community is seeing lately TERA doesn t worh the hassle
  • clfarron4clfarron4 ✭✭✭
    @Zoknahal If I believe correctly, the original reason for banning signs was because of being able to grief players anonymously. KTERA fixed this ages ago by adding who posted the sign above the sign itself with an NPC-style name above it (and yes, that is how it works in the NA build). So the problem about spamming profanity can now be dealt with using temporary bans because you can now attribute the sign to the poster.

    One legitimate use for signs, even though no-one is supposed to have them in NA TERA, is as location markers in dungeons, most notably in HH P4, because of their size. On EU, signs are generally used to be helpful, for example Guild Recruitment.

    I think that if they were to be enabled on the NA build, they would have to be heavily moderated at the beginning to make the point that spamming profanity would not be tolerated, but that would require a surge of GMs to watch it.
  • Both signs and dragon fireworks have the potential to cause Customer Support tickets. Dragon fireworks still have the potential to cause major lag if abused by players (until a GM is assigned to come in and fix it).

    Signs will always contain negative things, no matter what word filters are put in place. They also have a high potential to create Customer Support tickets. Players use them to attack each other, other guilds, or the game itself. It doesn't make any difference that the creator's name is displayed above the sign. It's still work for the support crew to come in, remove the sign, and dole out any necessary punishment to the one abusing the feature.

    Causing support tickets isn't exactly the end of the world, and you might be thinking "okay big deal, a few tickets happen," but the workload is surprising. It's a big deal for us when there are players out there waiting to have important tickets answered. The simplest fix is to remove the signs, and while obviously some people miss having them and have good intentions for using them, removing them doesn't negatively affect any game mechanics. btw this is the same reason we never allow players to use the megaphone.

    It's totally a "this is why we can't have nice things" scenario, but unfortunately that's the reality.
  • I know a lot of people want them as "markers" for various reasons. One of the more popular is to mark the "safe" spots in P4 of HH for people learning the DG. What about a version you can't write on. That would make a lot of people happy. @Spacecats
  • counterpointcounterpoint ✭✭✭✭✭
    TYoung11 wrote: »
    I know a lot of people want them as "markers" for various reasons. One of the more popular is to mark the "safe" spots in P4 of HH for people learning the DG. What about a version you can't write on. That would make a lot of people happy.

    Having generic placeable "markers" does seem like a good feature request. You could also make it so that it's only visible to the party/raid, if there's concern about performance in the open world.
  • Naru2008Naru2008 ✭✭✭
    TYoung11 wrote: »
    I know a lot of people want them as "markers" for various reasons. One of the more popular is to mark the "safe" spots in P4 of HH for people learning the DG. What about a version you can't write on. That would make a lot of people happy.

    Having generic placeable "markers" does seem like a good feature request. You could also make it so that it's only visible to the party/raid, if there's concern about performance in the open world.

    Similar to those tokens the game gives you while around the temples, so you can mark your path. I think they are meant for Balder's Temple iirc, but I might be wrong.
  • GatokatzenGatokatzen ✭✭✭
    Also add quest items some of them never dies, you can try to wipe all yout inventory or destroy them, but those items are inmortals.
  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for the answer @Spacecats

    Unfortunately, it is not a pleasant answer. Someone mentioned EU, yes, they are the prime example that the signs can work for its intended purpose without harassing or spouting profanity, if left alone.

    But unfortunately, i cannot see anything in your answer that can work as a solution to this items not being available in NA but yes in other regions.
    Just because the people at EME does not wanna deal with ticket support, is not a valid reason to simply remove the items, thats just the easy lazy solution.

    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop. If the main concern is the amount of tickets that can surge on the re release of this items, then proper measurements must be taken to deal with the amount of tickets.

    I see the long term benefit of the signs. They can be used as place markers for those who like to explore or someone wanting to lead the way to a place in the game, the amount of good uses this signs have, vastly outnumber the bad uses, such as insulting and profanity.

    @counterpoint I have to disagree. If you want a case on what good this signs can be for the game, lets just use these as examples:
    - Place markers for HH
    - Place markers for key spots in the TERA landscape for individuals and guilds, to use as their meeting place.
    - Role Play
    - Helping newbies find the way and/or helping them in their initial journey, with easy to understand instructions on what they have to do next, like, going to X place to complete an X quest.
    - In Game on spot Guild recruiting play.
    - Marking the way to a specific place.

    And many more imaginative uses. Overall i think they are a nice addition to the players to just have some fun outside of the normal daily grind. And ill use Fashion coupons for an example: People keep using more the costumes from the shop rather than the ones available in the Fashion Coupon shop, so using the logic in your initial post, what benefit to the game would bring updating the fashion coupon shop if people will keep using the stuff from the cash shop regardless? The same applies to the signs. Rather than have them completely removed, EME did not measured the benefits of the signs, and decided to simply remove them to not deal with support tickets, rather than working on a fix. Easy lazy solution.
  • Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.
  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.

    You do make a very valid point, and so do it, regarding the benefits of the signs can out weight the cons. I fully understand there will be a surge of tickets in the first few days, and smaller surges in the next days, but this surges will be smaller and smaller with time, leading to what the situation in EU is: Co existance in between the players, even the most trolly ones, and the signs.

    All i ask from you and the team at EME, is to reconsider the benefits of the signs, and make the effort of re introducing them, and that means, being fully prepared that a lot of people will use them for bad, but also fully knowing that the signs will be used by a vast majority of the players, for good instead of harassing and spouting profanity.

    I dont see why we the majority still have to pay for the errors of the minority.
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