Availability of deleted items: I think we waited long enough already.

2

Comments

  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thank you for the answer @Spacecats

    Unfortunately, it is not a pleasant answer. Someone mentioned EU, yes, they are the prime example that the signs can work for its intended purpose without harassing or spouting profanity, if left alone.

    But unfortunately, i cannot see anything in your answer that can work as a solution to this items not being available in NA but yes in other regions.
    Just because the people at EME does not wanna deal with ticket support, is not a valid reason to simply remove the items, thats just the easy lazy solution.

    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop. If the main concern is the amount of tickets that can surge on the re release of this items, then proper measurements must be taken to deal with the amount of tickets.

    I see the long term benefit of the signs. They can be used as place markers for those who like to explore or someone wanting to lead the way to a place in the game, the amount of good uses this signs have, vastly outnumber the bad uses, such as insulting and profanity.

    @counterpoint I have to disagree. If you want a case on what good this signs can be for the game, lets just use these as examples:
    - Place markers for HH
    - Place markers for key spots in the TERA landscape for individuals and guilds, to use as their meeting place.
    - Role Play
    - Helping newbies find the way and/or helping them in their initial journey, with easy to understand instructions on what they have to do next, like, going to X place to complete an X quest.
    - In Game on spot Guild recruiting play.
    - Marking the way to a specific place.

    And many more imaginative uses. Overall i think they are a nice addition to the players to just have some fun outside of the normal daily grind. And ill use Fashion coupons for an example: People keep using more the costumes from the shop rather than the ones available in the Fashion Coupon shop, so using the logic in your initial post, what benefit to the game would bring updating the fashion coupon shop if people will keep using the stuff from the cash shop regardless? The same applies to the signs. Rather than have them completely removed, EME did not measured the benefits of the signs, and decided to simply remove them to not deal with support tickets, rather than working on a fix. Easy lazy solution.
  • CornishRexCornishRex ✭✭✭✭
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Thank you for the answer @Spacecats

    Unfortunately, it is not a pleasant answer. Someone mentioned EU, yes, they are the prime example that the signs can work for its intended purpose without harassing or spouting profanity, if left alone.

    But unfortunately, i cannot see anything in your answer that can work as a solution to this items not being available in NA but yes in other regions.
    Just because the people at EME does not wanna deal with ticket support, is not a valid reason to simply remove the items, thats just the easy lazy solution.

    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop. If the main concern is the amount of tickets that can surge on the re release of this items, then proper measurements must be taken to deal with the amount of tickets.

    I see the long term benefit of the signs. They can be used as place markers for those who like to explore or someone wanting to lead the way to a place in the game, the amount of good uses this signs have, vastly outnumber the bad uses, such as insulting and profanity.

    @counterpoint I have to disagree. If you want a case on what good this signs can be for the game, lets just use these as examples:
    - Place markers for HH
    - Place markers for key spots in the TERA landscape for individuals and guilds, to use as their meeting place.
    - Role Play
    - Helping newbies find the way and/or helping them in their initial journey, with easy to understand instructions on what they have to do next, like, going to X place to complete an X quest.
    - In Game on spot Guild recruiting play.
    - Marking the way to a specific place.

    And many more imaginative uses. Overall i think they are a nice addition to the players to just have some fun outside of the normal daily grind. And ill use Fashion coupons for an example: People keep using more the costumes from the shop rather than the ones available in the Fashion Coupon shop, so using the logic in your initial post, what benefit to the game would bring updating the fashion coupon shop if people will keep using the stuff from the cash shop regardless? The same applies to the signs. Rather than have them completely removed, EME did not measured the benefits of the signs, and decided to simply remove them to not deal with support tickets, rather than working on a fix. Easy lazy solution.

    I fully agree, signs on eu are a normal thing and I know for a fact players on eu are much more toxic and generally uncomfortable to be around with (I was actually surprised by the rudeness a few times) and still I haven't seen very insulting/trolling signs.
    Once the novelty wears off people will forget about them, and they will be mostly used for reasons mentioned above.
    I'd really like if you guys could reconsider and reintroduce them because if EU can deal with them, why can't NA?
  • Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.
  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.

    You do make a very valid point, and so do it, regarding the benefits of the signs can out weight the cons. I fully understand there will be a surge of tickets in the first few days, and smaller surges in the next days, but this surges will be smaller and smaller with time, leading to what the situation in EU is: Co existance in between the players, even the most trolly ones, and the signs.

    All i ask from you and the team at EME, is to reconsider the benefits of the signs, and make the effort of re introducing them, and that means, being fully prepared that a lot of people will use them for bad, but also fully knowing that the signs will be used by a vast majority of the players, for good instead of harassing and spouting profanity.

    I dont see why we the majority still have to pay for the errors of the minority.
  • JXE5356AKEJXE5356AKE ✭✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.

    How is this different that some of the stuff spewed and spammed on global and other chat channels?

    Just request a dungeon only version of the item at least.
  • JXE5356AKE wrote: »
    How is this different that some of the stuff spewed and spammed on global and other chat channels?

    Customer support gets plenty of tasks thanks to harassment and inappropriate behavior in global chat. That doesn't really do much to help the case for providing more ways to harass.
    Just request a dungeon only version of the item at least.

    That's an interesting idea I can forward to the rest of the team, but it would definitely require development work in order to make it possible.
  • JXE5356AKEJXE5356AKE ✭✭✭
    Spacecats wrote: »
    JXE5356AKE wrote: »
    How is this different that some of the stuff spewed and spammed on global and other chat channels?

    Customer support gets plenty of tasks thanks to harassment and inappropriate behavior in global chat. That doesn't really do much to help the case for providing more ways to harass.
    Just request a dungeon only version of the item at least.

    That's an interesting idea I can forward to the rest of the team, but it would definitely require development work in order to make it possible.

    Well, I guess that's something, along with everything else that is forwarded to the team and results in nothing. I really do hope you understand the players' frustration when it seems like NA only gets restrictions from the base Korean game, and that BHS really does not design with our region in mind.
  • ElinUsagiElinUsagi ✭✭✭✭✭
    .
    JXE5356AKE wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    JXE5356AKE wrote: »
    How is this different that some of the stuff spewed and spammed on global and other chat channels?

    Customer support gets plenty of tasks thanks to harassment and inappropriate behavior in global chat. That doesn't really do much to help the case for providing more ways to harass.
    Just request a dungeon only version of the item at least.

    That's an interesting idea I can forward to the rest of the team, but it would definitely require development work in order to make it possible.

    Well, I guess that's something, along with everything else that is forwarded to the team and results in nothing. I really do hope you understand the players' frustration when it seems like NA only gets restrictions from the base Korean game, and that BHS really does not design with our region in mind.

    Alice costume... cought, cought... :cry:
  • counterpointcounterpoint ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 8
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Overall i think they are a nice addition to the players to just have some fun outside of the normal daily grind. And ill use Fashion coupons for an example: People keep using more the costumes from the shop rather than the ones available in the Fashion Coupon shop, so using the logic in your initial post, what benefit to the game would bring updating the fashion coupon shop if people will keep using the stuff from the cash shop regardless? The same applies to the signs.

    FWIW, not all "nice to have" items are created equally. As I was alluding to, the issue you're fighting against is convincing them that the benefits outweigh the potential support burden. That doesn't apply to the Fashion Coupon shop at all. Updating fashion coupons to give people more options is only going to make people happy, and simply requires some one-time work to get done, with no negative on-going support impact. I don't think you can say "well, if you're not going to give us signs, why bother giving us anything nice/optional at all, then?" The signs have their own unique challenge that would need to be overcome, and that's the hill you have to climb. And while I think your examples are interesting and potentially fun, I don't think you really made the case for their necessity. (And, for every good use you outlined, you could easily come up with a bad one. It only takes a few bad things to kill a proposal.)

    The argument about markers in dungeons is probably the best case for having something like this, but it'd probably be better served to just be a marker without text entry. Other MMOs have lettered/numbered markers for this express purpose, and that's a great feature request.

    I just want to be clear that I'm not categorically against signs, but I was just trying to warn you about the argument you were up against.
  • YemayaYemaya ✭✭
    I've seen gold sellers from weeks back that have been reported by people and still don't have a ban....and you're worried about troll signs who most people just look at, ignore, then carry on with their day? :/
  • VinyltailsVinyltails ✭✭✭
    If people want markers in dungeons....Just try to do Waymarker that only the party can see just like FF14 does or something

    Then again Engine/Server issues maybe cause lag when there's a giant beam of light permanently up (Good old UE3)
  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    How about this then @Spacecats

    The Team at EME can request a re usable version of the Dragon Fireworks and the Quarter Day/Half Day signs, just like the Disco Ball, and the Sand Castles.

    The Dragon Fireworks would be, upon use, under a cooldown of 1 minute, same as the Sand Castles and Disco ball. This would lessen the spam of thousands of those fireworks by a single person, knowing some people still have thousands of them in their banks and inventory.

    About the signs, a word filter wont do much, but you can take something from other publishers and use it on TERA: Bots. Some publishers, in order to lessen the workload on the actual team, use bots to deal with the minor tasks such as regulating chats to avoid profanity and other bad words. Is very common nowadays to see this minor tasks handled by a bot, while the major issues are handled by the actual team.

    I dont know much about bots, but it should be possible to set a bot to regulate not just the in game chat (which by the way, it spits a lot worse words and profanity than what ppl put in the signs, specially in global chat, and people also using very offensive and improper guild names.)

    As someone already said, i dont see any fairness on NA being the only region with such harsh restrictions on things other regions have and work just fine. It not only frustrates players, it shows poor management from the team behind NA TERA.

    Trolls will continue to exist and use this items for the worse, but that should not be a reason to deny access to things only a minority got access to because they were first logged in before this same trolls decided to pull their little prank.

    I would actually like to see the team at EME, like the last time, pin a suggestion thread like the old one regarding the in game shops, but this time, regarding this items, to see what the community think, and work together towards a solution that would work for both the players and the EME team.
  • CornishRex wrote: »
    I still have over 1k dragon fireworks on av. maybe someday I will sell them

    They were made untradeable recently lol
    Too late

    Oh for Pete's sake! :angry: These kind of unanticipated random changes to items years after they've been released/discontinued is one of the reasons I've largely stopped playing Tera. I gave all my dragon fireworks to my friend to store over New Years on the assumption I'd be getting half of them back. Now I've lost them forever. Thanks for that eme... I really appreciate it when you slap long time players.
  • CornishRexCornishRex ✭✭✭✭
    > @MorganPhoenix said:
    > CornishRex wrote: »
    >
    > allofspaceandtime wrote: »
    >
    > I still have over 1k dragon fireworks on av. maybe someday I will sell them
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > They were made untradeable recently lol
    > Too late
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Oh for Pete's sake! :angry: These kind of unanticipated random changes to items years after they've been released/discontinued is one of the reasons I've largely stopped playing Tera. I gave all my dragon fireworks to my friend to store over New Years on the assumption I'd be getting half of them back. Now I've lost them forever. Thanks for that eme... I really appreciate it when you slap long time players.

    Yup, no announcements, nothing.
    Eme patch notes are simply lacking, I didn't even know you could make swiftly hardy dyads until recently when I randomly fused some BECAUSE NOTHING WAS SAID IN THE PATCH NOTES REE
    Not to mention some bigger things aren't there either, like the buff to vergos that happened a while ago.
  • Spacecats wrote: »
    Zoknahal wrote: »
    Sure, there are lots of airheads in NA that will meme their way up with the signs and troll with the fireworks, but only for the first few days. If left alone, these people will soon stop.

    Sorry Zoknahal but I have to disagree there. There are signs left over in people's inventories from years back, and we still see them used in borderline ways to meme and tease others. Reintroducing them to thousands of players wouldn't just cause a one-time surge of support tickets. It would cause a huge surge followed by a continuous trickle of contacts, permanently increasing workload. I WANT TO BELIEVE, but in the world of MMOs the trolls will never get bored of trolling, harassment will always be a factor, and the analytics we use to measure our support process agree with that.

    You still see them used in borderline ways to "meme and tease others" (Honestly why would you even state it this way? There's nothing wrong with jokes and teasing from friends, it's straight up harassment you should consider and prevent, not harmless jokes which you can find in any aspect of the game that involves text) BECAUSE people can't get it out of their systems in one massive wave. Sometimes it's because the signs are still left in the merchant after a patch is released (because everything is always tested and checked amirite?) and then some people finally get the ability to use these items which are only removed in NA. What makes this region so vulnerable compared to other regions?
2
Sign In or Register to comment.