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Comments
You don't need talents just like you don't need Stormcry +9 to clear it. That argument never really made sense as it's objective stats. Talents can let some parties clear when they otherwise could not.
The biggest gate to most players from farming EM is actually a mix of skill and ping. While for many the servers are pretty stable for a decent part of the day, it is not so for some groups still. It is not impossible for someone at 100ms to clear EM, but it does take a significantly larger amount of effort to do so. And most people don't put that effort because outside of Elemental Essences it is just not as profitable for the effort required. Awakening should make EMs less painful for these people, and we have to accept while EM is actually not truly difficult, it is still a barrier that the majority of the playerbase can't clear at all.
It's not that you need +9 and slaying, it's that you need it to clear in a reasonable amount of time. Doubly true in the hell that is RMHM. There is no reason a dungeon should be taking 30-35 minutes when people are geared in +6/7 and above.
And saying "git gud" or "suck less" is not an excuse. Not every run can be a guild run. Sometimes people DC . Sometimes people aren't 100% attentive and take the wrong buff. Sometimes people die out of pure accident. Sometimes someone has to go bio/afk/phone because the damn dungeon is so long, and because of any of those reasons it might take a full hour to clear the dungeon.
MEANWHILE OVER IN KOREA, "Man I'm so bored guys, We just did RMHM 3 times in this hour, what else do you want to do?"
The assumption though is that NA should be brought up towards this level, rather than Ktera being brought down to an exportable state. The current disparity seems to me like a "oh, crap. We messed up. Nobody move, let's figure out what we're going to do about this" situation that Bluehole is going to have to tackle on their end first. If EME and Gameforge try responding in real time, it could be a horrendous optimization problem with moving targets and no clear idea where the game's going. For example: EME compensates for Talents, KTera addresses their problems, exports, but now we have the publisher compensation on top of the balance adjustments the developers made. How do players respond to rolling back one scheme (which they're used to) and replacing it with another because it's the "right" fix for the same problem, according to Bluehole?
Just a thought, along the lines of "this doesn't seem normal at all, so it's hard to judge what should happen without further developments."
Like I said before I'm not the most knowledgeable when it comes to patch timing but even if RKEM was released before awakening on ktera I still feel like it was designed with the awakening changes in mind for all regions. People were clearing RKEM day one of the patch in NA and it doesn't even require more than +5~ SC which I feel like is a decent gear gate for the hardest dungeon in the game...extreme mode. As far as balance between Korea and NA there is no denying that ktera has a strong advantage. However, how relevant is that in itself if it's possible to clear in all regions?
My main concern out of this thread is the balance of the game looking toward the future. We can only hope that bhs balanced around a non talent version of the game and/or doesn't make it to where dungeons actually do become so overpowered that we really do have problems clearing them.
Edit: I also wanted to drop an opinion on the whole "x class is already irrelevant" I'm in a guild that does RKEM everyday. Usually just sell runs but also learning runs very often. So i have a pretty decent sample size of runs to pull opinions from. Ninja is far from irrelevant. I have a ninja friend who stays right at my level of dps as a +9 zerk and one of our learner ninjas cleared the other day at +2 sc and she's only been playing the game 2 weeks! Our best dps player in the guild has 2 reapers and i can't even touch him in dps. I ran with a sorc the other day that was holding 2.8m before she died to a mech. I even watched a gunner solo a shield and consistently put over 2m up. The only class that seems to be suffering right now is archer and it's not much of a suffering as they are still accepted into parties no question. I have been playing this game since the last rmh patch and I've never seen a more balanced spread of dps across all the classes.
If your friend comes near your dps as a ninja then you are just a bad +9 zerk. Top zerk does 4m in RKEM as slaying and ninja does 2.75m.
So let's take the time to compare 2 runs that are non slaying. I chose to look at rk9nm as that was the dungeon to parse before the release of rk9em and the start of the slaying meta this patch. I noticed that the top parse for ninja was with a priest(gasp but that's the [filtered] healer) so I looked for the top parse for a zerk with a priest in the party. I came up with this: https://moongourd.com/encounter?area=735&boss=3000&log=5aa0c57b804a1 which is the #15 zerk parse, but the highest with a priest coming in at a cool 3.17m. I am comparing it to this: https://moongourd.com/encounter?area=735&boss=3000&log=5a866325bdb32 which is the highest ninja + priest run and the #1 ninja parse. The ninja is clocking 3.21. So if the party composition(tank, heal) is the same, and the party dps only has a 200k difference, how do you explain that? Is that just another bad zerk? I would also like the point out that Serk, The #1 zerk right now, is also in the ninja party, and he is only pulling 25k more dps than the ninja.
I feel like the obvious argument is oh #15 isn't #1 and that's what matters, but is that truly a viable argument when there is only 12 zerks who have managed to top this ninjas dps with any healer?
I'm not trying to turn this into a flame war or derail the topic. I just wanted to put up an example of what I mean when I say that dps across classes is closer than I've ever seen before. This mentality of "look at these numbers you're obviously just bad ninjas are horrible." Is a shallow, close minded, and completely inaccurate way to look at the game. Unfortunately it has become the accepted view as people with a limited knowledge of how the game actually works at the top of the ladder try to digest the state of balance and different tier lists. Is zerk better potential dps than ninja? Absolutely. Does it actually matter? not at all. In fact we just proved how ninja could potentially be better than zerk!
In the end what we really learn from these runs is that mystic isn't actually hands down the best healer to have in your parse ever. It actually depends on what class(es) you have in your party. Priest isn't very good for zerk as you rely on your abilities that take 3-5 seconds to cast critting as much as possible making mystic the obvious choice. Where as with a ninja you obviously get more benefits from a priest with the increased attack speed and cdr. THIS is class balance. One(priest) is better in one scenario and the other(mystic) is better in another scenario, but ppl scream everyday about priest being "unaccepted".
When awakening hits I imagine the disparity between classes will reach a new level, but we can only wait and see the actual stats. Then wait and see more stats when the next wave of awakening happens. However, this is how balance works. In any mmo/moba ever there is a "rotation" of what is the best and what isn't. It's not intentional, it's just the natural rythym that is balancing.
Okay, now I'm curious: let's say I am fine with it. Then what?
i will be trusted here how are the mind in my small guild
we will not waste time evolving guardian set or waste time in dungeons for useless loot...
we will continue spamming guardian missions and we really don't care if the mission will fail because my friends and me are weaks
we only wanna rush points to open more chests...
we will keep in bank all gold obtained, after all how more tera fail and lose players more cheaper costumes will be in the auction...
sorry folks but if the game is turning into a cancer for us it's time to be a cancer for them too
Well, if youre fine with RKe last boss lasts more than 10 mins then good for you!
Elitists are on every game and class inbalance also.
There would be always a better class to play than another for PvE content and for PvP also on every game.
This is something every single game suffers.
If you are good enought with your character you won't be excluded from most parties to run content, but yeah don't hope people trying score runs and speed runs let you be in their runs if you are with a low tier class.