Rollback Discussion

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Comments

  • TailofHartsTailofHarts ✭✭
    edited April 10
    I don't understand why we speculating on what would happen. We don't know for sure. All I've got to say, is EU got it done.
    The way I look at it, prices would go down eventually. You'd have people with more money to invest, more people interested in playing the game because they finally were able to afford to get a 2.0 dragon. This ain't about SES exploit. This is about people who cried because they didn't get a piece of cake. That is ALL people talked about in trade and global chat. /end rant It is pointless to try to explain.
    Just keep in mind that VETS are the people who keeping this alive. New players come and go.

    My point exactly. As someone who's dropped thousands on this game and knows others who've done the same, This could not be further from the truth. Veterans are what keep this game alive.
  • wokthefokwokthefok ✭✭
    edited April 10
  • CornishRexCornishRex ✭✭✭✭✭
    CornishRex wrote: »
    @TailofHarts
    Yep. The best part is, eme is a subsidiary to bhs. They should be the region that's thriving and doing better than other regions due to y'know having better access and communication with bhs. But nope. Here we are, with a patch that's two weeks later than EU's, patch notes that can't even rival theirs, reset scrolls that were allegedly adjusted for NA's economy *cough*notheyweren't*cough* and all other things that got messed up, that somehow other regions didn't mess up. EME sure is getting special treatment, and that treatment is neglect.
    This rollback should be a wake-up call to start testing patches more thoroughly but eh. Ehhh.

    Even if they test patches thoroughly they couldn't have planned for NA greed. I mean seriously, golden talents at 3k per talent? Some items seemed to still be reasonably priced ( IE some of the mounts and costumes and loot box's) but i saw people jacking the prices up so severely that no one besides people who hoarded their scrolls could afford. This certainly did not happen on EU , people still ended up with millions of gold there but the economy remained unchanged. No amount of testing done would have prepped them for how NA player actually behave. It's Greed, plain and simple.

    It didn't happen to EU because EU players had no reset scrolls to sell. Reset scrolls are only obtainable through the vg shop and most people spend their vg points on crafters cures on EU so nobody had huge stacks. Also their reset scroll prices got halved so there's that.
  • YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized.

    "The economy would have stabilized" isn't really the point at all. Of course the economy will eventually stabilize from any cataclysmic event until it reaches a new normal. The issue is: who are the winners and losers in that process, and is that fair? With a massive scale event like this, the impact isn't isolated so it's like you can just ban the "exploiters" and that's the end of it -- it completely pervades the game. The fact that eventually it'd reach equilibrium doesn't change the massive upheaval caused and the way that slants the economy in favor of the beneficiaries. The new players, the returning players, and those that didn't exploit all lose.

    This whole situation was caused by human error, and the rollback provides a way to undo those errors. Unlike real world cataclysmic events and the fallout that happens, a game gives you the chance to reset. Given that opportunity, it's better to go down a more fair and equitable path, even if it means people lose up to ~16 hours of play time, rather than having the results of the grossly unfair imbalance play out over months and months until equilibrium is reached.
  • MelyodisMelyodis ✭✭✭
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized within 3 months. Gold would have left those greedy veteran hands that had 3 months of zeta/eta reset scrolls (they were added january 2019, fyi, and were the only big source of gold from reset scrolls)

    Even if they were just added in January, anyone that saved up elite boxes for how many years would get them when you open the boxes just before the patch hit like I did.
  • YWLD3DX3WHYWLD3DX3WH ✭✭
    edited April 10
    I don't understand why we speculating on what would happen. We don't know for sure. All I've got to say, is EU got it done.
    The way I look at it, prices would go down eventually. You'd have people with more money to invest, more people interested in playing the game because they finally were able to afford to get a 2.0 dragon. This ain't about SES exploit. This is about people who cried because they didn't get a piece of cake. That is ALL people talked about in trade and global chat. /end rant It is pointless to try to explain.
    Just keep in mind that VETS are the people who keeping this alive. New players come and go.

    Time to ask all players their start date when they apply to my LFGs so I can actually kill the game by denying them from my parties so they have no reason to play, since they want to cry to the forums and have my personal time rolled back because they couldn't make the same gold as someone who's had elite for close to 5 years straight.
  • Naru2008Naru2008 ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 10
    wokthefok wrote: »

    It was Rox's opinion at the time. It wasn't an official statement, nor did he rule out completely a rollback. Politely get outta here trying to cause crap.
    He said 'I' not 'we'. It was obviously his viewpoint and that was before the exploit was made known to them.
  • YWLD3DX3WHYWLD3DX3WH ✭✭
    edited April 10
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized.

    "The economy would have stabilized" isn't really the point at all. Of course the economy will eventually stabilize from any cataclysmic event until it reaches a new normal. The issue is: who are the winners and losers in that process, and is that fair? With a massive scale event like this, the impact isn't isolated so it's like you can just ban the "exploiters" and that's the end of it -- it completely pervades the game. The fact that eventually it'd reach equilibrium doesn't change the massive upheaval caused and the way that slants the economy in favor of the beneficiaries. The new players, the returning players, and those that didn't exploit all lose.

    This whole situation was caused by human error, and the rollback provides a way to undo those errors. Unlike real world cataclysmic events and the fallout that happens, a game gives you the chance to reset. Given that opportunity, it's better to go down a more fair and equitable path, even if it means people lose up to ~16 hours of play time, rather than having the results of the grossly unfair imbalance play out over months and months until equilibrium is reached.

    Time to ask all players their start date when they apply to my LFGs so I can actually kill the game by denying them from my parties so they have no reason to play, since they want to cry to the forums and have my personal time (HINT: THIS IS THE IMPORTANT THING. PEOPLE HAVE TAKEN OFF WORK JUST TO BE SLAPPED IN THE FACE) rolled back because they couldn't make the same gold as someone who's had elite for close to 5 years straight.
  • YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED to a MUCH more healthy place and given new players good income by doing stuff that isnt running top tier dungeons if you all gave it time.

    You are pleased to have sold your moongourds for a far higher price than their value I get that. But does this boon outweigh the short term effect this inflation will have? I'd personally prefer to know my items sold and not simply cause a bunch of other players got a ton of extra gold in 24 hours.
  • YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED to a MUCH more healthy place and given new players good income by doing stuff that isnt running top tier dungeons if you all gave it time.

    You are pleased to have sold your moongourds for a far higher price than their value I get that. But does this boon outweigh the short term effect this inflation will have? I'd personally prefer to know my items sold and not simply cause a bunch of other players got a ton of extra gold in 24 hours.

    SHORT term inflation. Key point here ladies and gents
  • MargaretRoseMargaretRose ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 10
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized within 3 months. Gold would have left those greedy veteran hands that had 3 months of zeta/eta reset scrolls (they were added january 2019, fyi, and were the only big source of gold from reset scrolls)

    Perhaps you forgot to count the new price of PP potions?
    Not to mention elite? (assuming gold purchase).

    Edit:
    Also this.
    Melyodis wrote: »
    Even if they were just added in January, anyone that saved up elite boxes for how many years would get them when you open the boxes just before the patch hit like I did.
  • sanj66sanj66 ✭✭✭✭
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized.

    "The economy would have stabilized" isn't really the point at all. Of course the economy will eventually stabilize from any cataclysmic event until it reaches a new normal. The issue is: who are the winners and losers in that process, and is that fair? With a massive scale event like this, the impact isn't isolated so it's like you can just ban the "exploiters" and that's the end of it -- it completely pervades the game. The fact that eventually it'd reach equilibrium doesn't change the massive upheaval caused and the way that slants the economy in favor of the beneficiaries. The new players, the returning players, and those that didn't exploit all lose.

    This whole situation was caused by human error, and the rollback provides a way to undo those errors. Unlike real world cataclysmic events and the fallout that happens, a game gives you the chance to reset. Given that opportunity, it's better to go down a more fair and equitable path, even if it means people lose up to ~16 hours of play time, rather than having the results of the grossly unfair imbalance play out over months and months until equilibrium is reached.

    even if it means screwing the people that kept/keep the game alive by spending and playing over? how is that fair for people who got dungeon drops, enchanted or grinded levels?
  • YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED to a MUCH more healthy place and given new players good income by doing stuff that isnt running top tier dungeons if you all gave it time.

    You are pleased to have sold your moongourds for a far higher price than their value I get that. But does this boon outweigh the short term effect this inflation will have? I'd personally prefer to know my items sold and not simply cause a bunch of other players got a ton of extra gold in 24 hours.

    What part of that says I'm pleased? The gold doesn't matter to me, I'm just showing you a small example of how the economy would have worked to stabilize. What matters to me is my *time*.
  • Does this mean all the quests I did for the last 10 hours are gonna be reset?
  • YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    YWLD3DX3WH wrote: »
    ALSO of note, this "inflation" makes it MUCH easier for a new player to make money. I got bored and was looking through my bank, I had like 400 moongourds that I spent maybe an HOUR gathering when I was bored a few weeks ago and sold them for ~100k. Easy money for new players through gathering!
    I sold a few stacks of 100 lein's dark rootbeer for ~50k each. Easy money for new players! Makes crafting worthwhile!

    The economy would have STABILIZED if you all gave it time.

    Nice.
    What is the actual value of the gold you made?

    How much time would it take to stabilize?
    Active veteran players got 10-30m+ on reset scrolls alone.

    Do the math yourself. These are items that are always in demand, and are consumed VERY rapidly. Meaning they disappear. 100k is 1% of 10 million. Meaning for just ~1-2 hours a day, for 100 days, you too could make 10 million being a brand new player. i.e. the economy would have stabilized.

    "The economy would have stabilized" isn't really the point at all. Of course the economy will eventually stabilize from any cataclysmic event until it reaches a new normal. The issue is: who are the winners and losers in that process, and is that fair? With a massive scale event like this, the impact isn't isolated so it's like you can just ban the "exploiters" and that's the end of it -- it completely pervades the game. The fact that eventually it'd reach equilibrium doesn't change the massive upheaval caused and the way that slants the economy in favor of the beneficiaries. The new players, the returning players, and those that didn't exploit all lose.

    This whole situation was caused by human error, and the rollback provides a way to undo those errors. Unlike real world cataclysmic events and the fallout that happens, a game gives you the chance to reset. Given that opportunity, it's better to go down a more fair and equitable path, even if it means people lose up to ~16 hours of play time, rather than having the results of the grossly unfair imbalance play out over months and months until equilibrium is reached.

    Tell that to people who sacrificed their wages for yesterday. I'm sure they would appreciate it. At the end of the day, no one will be happy. What ever happened to KitTeaCup's promise with connecting with the community? All this talk about increasing player input from the Proxy Fiesta, a couple of months back, seems to be just another empty promise. People are fed up regardless of this situation of unfairness. EME has no connection with their player base and they wonder what they're doing wrong..
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