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About tanks

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Comments

  • YamazukiYamazuki ✭✭✭✭✭
    Odes wrote: »
    @darkstriker07 i disagree, take 2 players good at their class, 1 brawler 1 lancer, and brawler comes out ahead by miles, it doesnt matter what lancer does. The hard truth is eveything is easier/better with a brawler cause of high dps and ability to skip boss mechanics and generally shorten fights and reduce risk of any complications.

    Also im not sure how you are supposed to do 1 mil dps, you are talking about best geared possible lancer atm or what? Cause im 3x slaughter (including weapon) and 2x Dread, and my average is 400-450k. I can reach 1mil burst during AR with mystic in party but thats about it.

    Depends on your gear rolls and glyphs, and rotation. I've seen Lancers in SF dealing 700k~1m. That's just their own damage, they also increase their party's damage as well. Most Lancers don't do that much damage for a couple reasons, their gear is not rolled perfectly for dps, and secondly there is no pressure for the Lancer to actually to damage. If they were required to deal high amounts of damage to hold aggro then you would probably see their average damage go up.
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yamazuki wrote: »
    Odes wrote: »
    @darkstriker07 i disagree, take 2 players good at their class, 1 brawler 1 lancer, and brawler comes out ahead by miles, it doesnt matter what lancer does. The hard truth is eveything is easier/better with a brawler cause of high dps and ability to skip boss mechanics and generally shorten fights and reduce risk of any complications.

    Also im not sure how you are supposed to do 1 mil dps, you are talking about best geared possible lancer atm or what? Cause im 3x slaughter (including weapon) and 2x Dread, and my average is 400-450k. I can reach 1mil burst during AR with mystic in party but thats about it.

    Depends on your gear rolls and glyphs, and rotation. I've seen Lancers in SF dealing 700k~1m. That's just their own damage, they also increase their party's damage as well. Most Lancers don't do that much damage for a couple reasons, their gear is not rolled perfectly for dps, and secondly there is no pressure for the Lancer to actually to damage. If they were required to deal high amounts of damage to hold aggro then you would probably see their average damage go up.

    Yup. Pretty much this right here. I'm venturing into DFNM on my 2013 lancer which I hardly ever used. I have it on only DN +12 but because I know some +15 people are doing that dungeon, I set my lancer up for aggro. I have three gear setups (full aggro, aggro and crit, and full dps for soloing) and two glyph setups. (aggro and dps). So last time I did DFNM I held aggro on my aggro setup against a +15 gunner on all the fights. Damage was puny, but I was keeping bosses in place (except lancer who's a [censored]) and doing utility (debilitate and shouts) while keeping myself alive using pots, i-frames and iron will because the healer was too busy keeping the dps alive. In other runs where dps is lower, I can use my aggro+crit factor setup to bring some more dps into the fight. Or go full dps in places like CW.
  • After read the answers, i think that lancer match more my style (i like high defense classes, absortion tanks, like a "wall"), lancer seems to be more resistant than brawler, leaving the damage source aside. Last question, u guys think that i will have some trouble at keeping aggro at DFNM with a dreadnaught +12 lancer? Tyvm
  • YamazukiYamazuki ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2016
    WilLegend wrote: »
    After read the answers, i think that lancer match more my style (i like high defense classes, absortion tanks, like a "wall"), lancer seems to be more resistant than brawler, leaving the damage source aside. Last question, u guys think that i will have some trouble at keeping aggro at DFNM with a dreadnaught +12 lancer? Tyvm

    No, Lancer is not dependent on doing damage for aggro like Brawler is. It will depend on you and your group though.
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    WilLegend wrote: »
    After read the answers, i think that lancer match more my style (i like high defense classes, absortion tanks, like a "wall"), lancer seems to be more resistant than brawler, leaving the damage source aside. Last question, u guys think that i will have some trouble at keeping aggro at DFNM with a dreadnaught +12 lancer? Tyvm

    Just read my previous post. You will be fine at DFNM.
  • Yay i saw it, just wondering if it stills working with the newer classes in the game giving a lot of dps like ninja, but seems it still :)
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    WilLegend wrote: »
    Yay i saw it, just wondering if it stills working with the newer classes in the game giving a lot of dps like ninja, but seems it still :)

    So long as you keep attacking and not just standing there with the shield always up, you will be able to keep aggro even against a +15 ninja. What I do is that a few of my attacks are glyphed to increase aggro generation. When I'm don't have to block something too lethal, I pop Iron Will and use those attacks. I personally am an aggressive tank, attacking as often as I can and only blocking for short periods of time instead of turtling.
  • feazesherofeazeshero ✭✭✭
    edited July 2016
    I think you should be fine with dread +12 as long as you keep up your rotations. Although it is easier to keep aggro, you may have to dps a bit if you have aggressive/skilled +15 dps in your party. Doing damage is what helps keep aggro nowadays. Shouts on the other hand don't help in much unless you have a lot of damage built in with it.

    Aggro glyphs on shield barrage and counter are very helpful. You can easily roll a full dps rolls on lance with full dps jewelry and maintain aggro just fine. Keep in mind the aggro jewelries are not good anymore and rolling aggro lines on lancer not good as well. I would recommend to follow this guide on essentialmana:

    essentialmana.com/fucbois-lancer-pve-guide/

    If you normally start tanking a lot with lancer later on, I'd recommend at least slaughter if that's the route you go. It will be a huge boost from dread and give you more damage, which results in better aggro generation. A lot of tanking would also depend on what etchings you go with, weapon crystals, gear rolls, skill rotations and etc. When I upgraded my gunner & ninja from dreadnaught to slaughter, oh my; what a boost it was dps wise for me.

    And also one more thing is that some people may say that lancer isn't dependent or required to do damage. I kinda disagree with that. As you get more experience later, there is potential to do real good dps on lancer. All I can say is that it will come slowly with experience and practice.
  • dinnersdinners ✭✭✭
    feazeshero wrote: »
    Lancer is fun but to be real good, it requires a lot of skill and time to learn. Brawler is easier to play because of the certain skills that can block and auto block while keeping up growing fury. The new buffs to lancer such as the HTL stacks and adrenaline rush are real good atm.

    I kind of agree with darkstriker07. If the person playing behind lancer is really skilled, lancer is somewhat preferable than brawler. It also depends if lancer party is real good as well in keeping up debuffs. Add that along if brawler can't keep up growing fury for most of the fight, then for sure lancer will win that battle.

    Skilled lancers can dish somewhere between an avg of 600k/s - 1m/s dps depending on party if they time things right and keep up their rotations correctly. Not many people may expect or believe this because its rare to see good lancers around and most people get used to playing with brawler tanks in their parties.

    I know, you are the one of the good lancer player.

    But, honestly, brawler is much stronger than lancer in pve with avg +12 set with avg jewel set. Lancer, archer and zerker depend too much on gears, crit rate and low ping. Lancer, archer and zerker can't be matched againt brawler and ninja without 280~310 crit rate or high attack speed for lancer, A decent brawler can keep Growing Fury with avg gear set.

    With same skill and avg +12 gear and 220~230 crit rate, Lancer can't match with brawler yet. Adren rush duration should be increased to 40 sec to 1min in dungeon. Onslaughter should be defensive attack skill against monsters.

    +15 team can clear any pve easily, maybe except SSHM and DS upper. It actually doesn't matter whether it's war tank, zker tank, brawler or lancer with +15 team. Just lancer requires much better skill, better gear and low ping to be good.
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