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How hard do you think the 30 Man really is?

On the google doc talking about the 30 man I'm sure everyone has seen, the developer claims.. "that this is the most difficult dungeon thus far". Do you think this is true? Albeit KN20 was kind of difficult in my opinion when it was first released, especially with it being a 20 man, it was still hard for some people to clear it by the end of its stay in Tera. What do you think of the 30 man difficulty? I've heard that apparently it was so hard, the Koreans who tested it told the developers it was too hard, and they had to go back and fix some things, but they are still sticking by the idea that it is the most difficult content in Tera thus far. Do you agree?

BTW here's the doc if you haven't seen it: https://docs.google.com/document/d/12_IhP3Ds68RbQeyx9WoZLsoU1jF2JyFhp38gG4bYjFM/edit


  • FleettFleett ✭✭✭✭
    The hard part will be the lag fest.
  • CezzareCezzare ✭✭✭
    Fleett wrote: »
    The hard part will be the lag fest.

    Lag has always been the real final boss in Tera.
  • ZoknahalZoknahal ✭✭✭✭✭
    According to the document, the lag issue is being looked into by the BHS Team. I remember they called out to the players that they needed testers. I think 24 players were selected to stress test the new dungeons and the 30 man raid in order to find a solution to the lag.

    I think it will be a decent difficulty Raid Dungeon. At least i am expecting it to be it, considering you will need 30 people to clear it.
  • It'll probably be a bit more difficult than AIHM tbh
  • vkobevkobe ✭✭✭✭✭
    like kelsek 20 people

    so if someone in your group crash good luck :)
  • KetothKetoth ✭✭✭✭
    Possums wrote: »
    It'll probably be a bit more difficult than AIHM tbh

    AIHM wasnt hard. Unless your raid had low dps and couldnt break the shileds or 2 shots the mobs before they went to vents
  • Possums wrote: »
    It'll probably be a bit more difficult than AIHM tbh

    Lel, that trash dungeon was so easy I can only remember it from people quoting it. Dude don't ruin my hopes for this 30-man :/
  • Elinu1Elinu1 Canada ✭✭✭✭
    gonna be really laggy to do 30 man even with my beast rig
  • AulonAulon ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2016
    Getting 30 people together to do it will be the hardest part, sitting waiting for random afks, 3 hours to start 15 mins to clear.
  • Aulon wrote: »
    Getting 30 people together to do it will be the hardest part, sitting waiting for random afks, 3 hours to start 15 mins to clear.

    If you get a set group who will be able to be online and run it at a set time that shouldn't be a problem. And doubt it would take 15 minutes considering it has four stages, unless you're planning to stop on the first stage.
  • NopiNopi ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2016
    If by hard they mean the coordinated debuff dances people had to do for Manaya HM, then imagine something like that, as quick as SSHM attacks, and with 30 man. If one single player fails a single step, party wipes. kek. That'd be hard indeed.
  • I filled out a 30 man roster for my guild, pretty excited for the raid. It's being praised as the hardest content to be put in tera. I really hope they follow through with all the hype :3
  • canikizucanikizu ✭✭✭
    The dungeon is gonna be by stages. I assume lower stages (1,2) are easy enough and puggable, but higher stages will be harder and need network of people for that.
  • voidyvoidy ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 2016
    I honestly hope it's simple. Barely anyone plays anymore. It's hard to fill an LFG for Demokron Factory, and nobody even talks about Wonderholme. Hell, you get Wonderholme ... its mechanic at the end is like a [filtered] coloring game, and all you have to do is make sure everybody's together before you start moving and then you can rest assured that nobody will get left behind and die, but people can't even do that. There's always someone, usually a ninja or a reaper don't ask me why, who runs ahead of everyone else and then the mechanic glitches and kills five people because Mr. Special just couldn't wait. Or look at Forsaken Island -- when the tombstones pop up and all people have to do is kill them to stop a ghost from mauling the healer, none of the DPS want to stop and help out, so you get your poor priest running around in circles while a ghost with an axe chases her. Or look at Demokron Factory: at the trash mobs between bosses, it's always so much quicker if you let the tank round everything up first, but you people never do. There's always some smug ninja who runs in and nearly gets himself killed trying to be the tank, and then the tank's stuck cleaning up after him. What's my point? My point is that for a lot of people filling this 30 man will require grabbing randoms, and randoms SUCK when they're asked to do even the most BASIC team oriented [filtered] that isn't just dragging their pudgy cheeto-dusted fingers along their sticky number keys to churn out their cookie cutter rotation.

    Hell, remember Akeron's Inferno? Holy [filtered], there was an easy dungeon. Total faceroll. The only time people even had to care about anyone but themselves was at the end, when we'd ask the DPS to kill adds so the adds wouldn't clog the vents. Just, kill adds. Literally the only other job the DPS had there. Yet every time, nobody cleared adds. "It's ok, I have retribution" they'd say. "It's okay, I have a robot," they'd say. That's great, not everyone's a new class with a baby-mode iframe that lasts 12 seconds. Randoms, especially DPS players for some reason, are so consistently bad about fulfilling team oriented goals, it's staggering. So many of them just don't give a [filtered]. You have this in 5 man groups. You have this in 7 man groups. You have this in 10 man groups. Imagine how bad it'll be in 30 man groups if the mechanics are actually complex and punish the entire team for the failure of one person. No PUG group would finish it. You'd have one or two large groups of merged statics, and maybe a big guild clear here and there.

    Such a system isn't inherently bad, but it's so obviously NOT the kind of game BHS wants to make anymore. Why do you think DSL was brought back without being scaled for the new gear? Why do you think FI was nerfed twice? Why do you think DFNM was nerfed? Why do you think solo content is rewarding players with group dungeon prizes? Why do you think every new class comes with its own arsenal of killer moves and iframes and HP boosts? BHS is catering to casuals. Again, nothing inherently wrong with that either, but it's just obvious that that's what they're doing now, that's what they've been doing for months, and that's why I think the devs are blowing smoke and building hype. I think they know that the only way their game stays alive is if the content is something people -- all people, even the laziest, most inconsiderate people who should have quit the game for Farmville at level 20 -- will want to attempt, and they know that 90% of players aren't going to want to spend their free time corralling 30 people into a dungeon that wipes them because one guy wasn't standing in the red circle pattern with everyone else.
  • SaphirKanzakiSaphirKanzaki ✭✭✭✭
    I was progress raiding WoW classic when you had raids of 40. The hardest part really is the discipline. Setting up a time and everyone is good to go? Forget it.
    I'm not filling whole blocks about discipline, but it ranges from "Oh, do I need potions/buff extras/etc." to "I totally forgot we're raiding today" and "stop playing death metal on teamspeak". We needed group leaders for discipline, substitute players, a raid leader, section leaders (healers, DPS, tanks).

    Given that Tera is directed at casual players so far, tackling these organizational problems alone would be hard enough. As we are not familiar with progress raiding in Tera, I do not expect this to be very hard. We neither have DKP (dragon kill points, a group internal loot bidding system) in Tera, which usually is a sign of a hard course.

    At least I expect a oneshot mechanism that regulary kills one raid member for fun as we have infight resurrection and deaths are free of charge (no gold cost for armor repair, no breaking crystals, etc.).
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