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[RESOLVED]The problem of item level restrictions in the new dungeons
EDIT: Seems like Enmasse has agreed to lower Vanguard ilevel requirements, hopefully for the dungeons I've mentioned and which are to come. Yay. http://forums.enmasse.com/tera/discussion/comment/8537#Comment_8537
The new dungeons released in the ninja patch have absurdly high item level requirements for obtaining the Vanguard rewards. There are currently only 3-4 dungeons worthwhile in endgame (SS, DF, ABHM, arguably WH), and only DF out of these has an ilevel requirement below 409. This leaves the vast majority of the playerbase with lame excuses for dungeons like ABNM and FINM in addition to DF. Why is it that characters in +15lucid, enough gear to clear all content from last patch, should be excluded from all these dungeons easily clearable in Dread?
On +15 lucid gunner, the ilevel restrictions prevent me from running any dungeon except DF. I will be forced to replace some of my lucid pieces with Slaughter, which is often worse due to the lack of an additional statline. On my brawler with 4/5 Starfall, one +15 and one +14, I am still 1 ilevel short of being able to obtain rewards from SSHM which is being released next week. How is this reasonable?
The current ilevel system is ridiculously bad at actually representing the amount of stats a character has on its gear. The fact that +15 Lucid, which is comparable to or better than Slaughter depending on the piece, yet has a far lower ilevel than Slaughter, makes no sense. Yes, it does prevent undergeared people from IMSing into dungeons that they cannot clear, but that should be a function of its own and not influence rewards from actually clearing dungeons. As I see it, it's simply an excuse to exclude players from higher-tiered dungeons in order to force an opening into their wallets.
If youre frustuated from being excluded from the majority of endgame content which you know you can easily clear, because you have not bothered grinding for days for each of your alts, please voice your concerns here with me
The new dungeons released in the ninja patch have absurdly high item level requirements for obtaining the Vanguard rewards. There are currently only 3-4 dungeons worthwhile in endgame (SS, DF, ABHM, arguably WH), and only DF out of these has an ilevel requirement below 409. This leaves the vast majority of the playerbase with lame excuses for dungeons like ABNM and FINM in addition to DF. Why is it that characters in +15lucid, enough gear to clear all content from last patch, should be excluded from all these dungeons easily clearable in Dread?
On +15 lucid gunner, the ilevel restrictions prevent me from running any dungeon except DF. I will be forced to replace some of my lucid pieces with Slaughter, which is often worse due to the lack of an additional statline. On my brawler with 4/5 Starfall, one +15 and one +14, I am still 1 ilevel short of being able to obtain rewards from SSHM which is being released next week. How is this reasonable?
The current ilevel system is ridiculously bad at actually representing the amount of stats a character has on its gear. The fact that +15 Lucid, which is comparable to or better than Slaughter depending on the piece, yet has a far lower ilevel than Slaughter, makes no sense. Yes, it does prevent undergeared people from IMSing into dungeons that they cannot clear, but that should be a function of its own and not influence rewards from actually clearing dungeons. As I see it, it's simply an excuse to exclude players from higher-tiered dungeons in order to force an opening into their wallets.
If youre frustuated from being excluded from the majority of endgame content which you know you can easily clear, because you have not bothered grinding for days for each of your alts, please voice your concerns here with me
4
Comments
I wish there could be something done about this
http://forums.enmasse.com/tera/discussion/1019/vanguard-item-level-requirement#latest
http://tera-forums.enmasse.com/forums/general-discussion/topics/vanguard-item-level-requirement?page=1
^
spacecats had responded to this in the old forums saying he and treeshark would send a request in to BHS. But look...Guess BHS didn't care
I think this issue warrants a thread of its own as it specifically concerns the new dungeons introduced in the Ninja patch. But I'll edit the title to make it clearer.
In short, I suspect that the ilvl restriction to VG reward is because it is tied to the instance matching system (and there is no reason to make the VG window has the option to do instance match when it already exists on its own). We need to let the developers know that everyone is in gear progression whether the ilvl restriction is there or not. Healers have been crying about this a lot, but it's not like they are not progressing. Healers do upgrade their armor, maybe a few pieces of jewelries, what not. Only a few specific items that some healers choose not to upgrade (e.g. rings, weapon) and that is preventing the new content from being rewarding.
Regarding the new dungeons - how come the ilvl of ABHM 'magically' increased compared to the "event" version of it? BHS pls.
ABHM is a bit harder than ABEM (but not as hard as original ABHM).
Krakatox hits through my block again I'm so happy
I just got Slaughter Armor / Greaves to +9 and Belt, now I have iLv409 with Lucid Weapon+15 and Gloves. You should try upgrading first.
On a side not, reset scrolls don't even work on the current dungeons, so it makes grinding for the new jewls difficult (in the hopes of getting them to raise my ilvl a tad). I plan to grind the new HM and it would be nice if I could get my VGs too while doing so. Idk, my priest is pretty well geared imo and I would just like to get VGs from running dungeons :')
I think the point is though people will upgrade eventually, but shouldn't be force to do it especially since some people have multiple toons they want to gear for, and now with the current feedstock supply, may become increasinly difficult. Not to mention, mindlessly upgrading doesn't necessarily mean that the new gear is better.
People had no problem clearing the Event ABHM in Dread. This current ABHM is even easier than the event version, yet magically ilvl for VG is set to 409 as opposed to 402 from the VG. My full lucid brawler is 405, can tank it without breaking a sweat until the last maybe 10% when kakakakakatox gets his super OP powerbuff that actually starts going through block. Why should I be forced to upgrade just for this? Someone made the suggestion and I agree with 100%: if you can clear it, you should be rewarded for it. This was advertised as a skill based action combat mmo no? Where it prioritizes you not getting hit while dealing damage? So theoretically shouldn't they abide by the spirit of this mmo and actually increase the reward for people who are clearing this with "subpar" gear?
And lastly: healers still abide by the Hydread Settings because every other rings that came after that is suboptimal for their role as healers. Are you suggesting that they should be punished for actually gearing their toons with "Best in Slot" gear?
IMHO upgrading should be optional: there will be at that point in time where you will NOT be able to get away with your current gear. We are all seasoned players here, we all know where that line is. And we know when we really need to upgrade before people /inspect you and go dafuq?!? NO! But we shouldn't be forced into it.
Sure, a team of Schisma CAN do Wonderholme, it doesn't have any wipe mechanics or anything, just teamwork, but you bet your [filtered] they'll be in there for 45 minutes to an hour.
Honestly, the vanguard is probably set this way to deter dreadnaught and VM5 from doing these new dungeons. On MT, pretty much everyone LFGs. Which, you know, it sucks, I get it, it kinda sucks, but you know what, there's a slaughter weapon there, that, etchings and 3% aside, are -better- than your lucid. We've had 2 triple drop events, hell, spacecats gave out 3 hearts on stream last week, and 10% or above of any starfall piece dropped from dreadspire every. single. run. It's been almost a year since lucid was released. You have no more excuses, no more complaints, it is not hardcore to expect someone to upgrade their weapon to the next vm if they had the previous one, in six months.
the previous threads were released to complain about HEALERS having vanguard ilvl issues, not anybody else, and specifically because the healers get the short end of the stick on VM7. NOBODY ELSE.
tl;dr there is a massive difference between 'clearing content' and holding back a team of more sufficient players. We've all seen IMS, we all know what the average playerbase can bring. Just get the slaughter people, lucid is now gen.
What if i told you there's people with lucid 15+ that can outdps people with SF 15+? If you can clear the dung you should be rewarded for it, simple as that. Sure, you might not trust every player with lucid 15+ to play godly to make up for the gear and would just refuse to take said player in your party. But, that's something that the party decides (Aka players) not BHS/EME. As of now, we as players dont even get decide or choose and that has to change.
Let's not forget that your numbers are most likely skewed from a 10% buff to Starfall, eh?
Holding back a team of sufficient player? Ok? See my post where I said at some point people are gonna inspect and go "HELL NAH!". Yea, the leader of the lfg will decide if "Lucid" is too scrubby for that particular run. If that's your lfg, than that's fine, as of right now that I know of. I still see no problem with anyone in lucid getting into lfg groups. So I don't know where you got that idea from. Lucid being too scrubby, maybe when people can reliably make vm7. Like you said, it's day 3 into patch. Lucid isn't as dated as you think. Plus am I supposed to gear everyone of my toons in starfall? With respect, I don't think you're thinking about the bigger picture.