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Please no more mats events: R.I.P Economy

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Comments

  • PixelatorPixelator ✭✭✭✭
    Eiiji wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Are you saying the amount of enchanting materials in Night of the Mandragora was too high, or are you just looking back at TERA Mongo?

    The majority of enchanting mats granted during this latest event were from Mandragora Boxes, and those contain a variety of items. The only Alkahest inside those is non-tradeable, Personal Alkahest. There are a lot of comments in this thread referencing Mongos, and the loot design in Mandragora was a direct result of TERA Mongo: Neon granting too many enchanting materials across the board.

    bro, don't listen to these trolls, they want to be the only ones running around with +15s.
    Haha, not like you can do damage with your +15 anyways, due to your self-inflicted "handicap".
  • SpacecatsSpacecats ✭✭✭✭✭
    Eiiji wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Are you saying the amount of enchanting materials in Night of the Mandragora was too high, or are you just looking back at TERA Mongo?

    The majority of enchanting mats granted during this latest event were from Mandragora Boxes, and those contain a variety of items. The only Alkahest inside those is non-tradeable, Personal Alkahest. There are a lot of comments in this thread referencing Mongos, and the loot design in Mandragora was a direct result of TERA Mongo: Neon granting too many enchanting materials across the board.

    bro, don't listen to these trolls, they want to be the only ones running around with +15s.

    Well I don't want to discredit anyone's feedback, Eiiji. If there's a way we can keep event loot enjoyable I want to hear ideas. If people just want to make more gold on the broker, though, that sort of limits what I can change in the future :p
  • LancerJiva wrote: »
    Kanayuu wrote: »
    Can we let the economy be itself for a while and stop having enchanting materials in any events for a while? I don't think we want +15 current vm players running around anywhere.

    But pls do a reset event where you manually reset dungeon entrances for the servers. cx

    Economy is fine, 3 years ago it was like this, mats were cheap, people got by just fine. It's only the rich people such as yourself that complain.

    I spent like 2k bucks in this year and I think mats events are good for the wallet.
  • Spacecats wrote: »
    Eiiji wrote: »
    Spacecats wrote: »
    Are you saying the amount of enchanting materials in Night of the Mandragora was too high, or are you just looking back at TERA Mongo?

    The majority of enchanting mats granted during this latest event were from Mandragora Boxes, and those contain a variety of items. The only Alkahest inside those is non-tradeable, Personal Alkahest. There are a lot of comments in this thread referencing Mongos, and the loot design in Mandragora was a direct result of TERA Mongo: Neon granting too many enchanting materials across the board.

    bro, don't listen to these trolls, they want to be the only ones running around with +15s.

    Well I don't want to discredit anyone's feedback, Eiiji. If there's a way we can keep event loot enjoyable I want to hear ideas. If people just want to make more gold on the broker, though, that sort of limits what I can change in the future :p

    he doesn't give ideas and he doesn't say how did the event affected him badly. he is just saying it ruined the economy and no reason behind it . the event was great he is just trolling
  • Kanayuu wrote: »
    Can we let the economy be itself for a while and stop having enchanting materials in any events for a while? I don't think we want +15 current vm players running around anywhere.

    But pls do a reset event where you manually reset dungeon entrances for the servers. cx

    why dont we need vm players what is wrong if people have vm. and how is the economy ruined how did effected u negatively
  • edited November 2016
    kamizuma wrote: »
    economy is NOT fine atm lol

    the only people the current economic state benefits are the:

    1. already rich (25 mil+ gold players)
    2. people that have the means to just buy emp irl

    Hey Kami, i was just wondering and i know you probably get this a lot buddy, but what do you think about cutting a bit of that slice pie you have? I mean, Im probably not the most poorest person in Tera, but im still kind of a bit low on that gold with 60k left right now. Maybe if i had a couple hundred K, i could get my new brawler tank guile geared but still anything helps.
  • Ves1978Ves1978 ✭✭✭✭
    as far as i'm concerned, cheap mats are a good thing. hope it will stay that way.
  • Ves1978 wrote: »
    as far as i'm concerned, cheap mats are a good thing. hope it will stay that way.

    i hope that 2. lets hope cat doesn't listen to him
  • edited November 2016
    Yamazuki wrote: »
    kamizuma wrote: »
    LancerJiva wrote: »
    The people who complain about the economy have thousands of enchanting materials and are complaining that since the prices are so cheap, they cannot make anymore gold over it. At the current state, it benefits poor players and even new 65s. The ones that complain are the greedy rich players.

    Cheap enchanting materials benefit poor players/new 65s that don't have gold so they need to sell their mwa/feedstock to get said gold? Cheap enchanting materials are bad for rich players that can just buy them all out and progress even further in gear in a shorter amount of time and with less gold than in the past?

    Yeah, the problem isn't the cheap mats to buy, the problem is the low price to sell farmed mats. People are just looking at the low-priced consumables and thinking "it's good because I can buy things for cheap" -- but where does the gold to purchase those mats come from? Where is that money going? Where does the supply of consumables come from? The amount of straight gold you earn from vanguard and as drops isn't enough to pay for all the mats you need, so you'd need to be able to sell things, but you're making less. For F2P players without much gold, they probably don't have Elite either, so even their selling comes at a price. So even though the mats are cheap, there's no real way to get ahead -- unless you yourself hit the jackpot on an event (which masks the problem) or you sell EMP.

    That said, even if you do re-balance the supply, we still need to address the issue of the already-rich being able to control the market without any cost/penalty. As I've said before, even though it won't be popular, we need to add/increase the broker listing tax for Elite.

    You can sell a lot of other things that aren't feedstock/mwa. I don't know why people act like that's the only way to make gold. I do not sell enchanting materials ever and I still make more gold than is needed. Before 1 single DFNM per character per day for a long time earned you 2,000 gold until it dropped to under 1,000 gold, and even then. You could also have been doing IOD and selling the tears for 2,000+g ea or secrets for almost 4,000g ea. Then at the start of this patch you could sell the boxes for almost 4,000gea and the other for over 1,000gea along with the other mats that can be traded for over 100g ea and 2,000~3,000g ea. All these VM mats will earn you more gold than simply selling MWA or feedstock would. Currently you can get Ambush weapon design that sell for 500,000g to 1,000,000 depending on how early you sold it and class. I know people will say that requires you to win a roll, but not if you find 4 people to split since 500k to 1m split between 5 people is still 100k to 200k. Then during events, like the recent, you could have easily made a couple hundred thousand gold selling tokens, which is again far more than you could selling MWA or feedstock as an average person... Selling enchanting mats was always a bad way to make gold anyways as a person who isn't rich since you needed the enchanting mats yourself, how ever, what you could sell is any BiS related mat or cosmetics since these people aren't going for BiS any time soon.

    Well... I actually kind of agree with you on this point. Some people are a bit too dependant on being able to sell enchanting materials for their gold because that used to be a good way. Clearly it isn't a good way now, and you need to look for more creative ways. I think you've found a number of good ones, but I suspect part of the reason it works for you is that not everyone's thought of it yet. The more people are "in" on those secrets, the more difficult it'll be to make money those ways, so you constantly have to be searching and shifting based on supply and demand.

    (This is basically why I've always said that no broker fees are the true real value of Elite for people who know how to use it. Most people don't know how.)
  • We r talking about the second mongo event. Not the mandragora. Lol
  • CutechanCutechan ✭✭✭
    edited November 2016
    I think the economy is fine. 3 years player here.

    Also kamizuma pls be my sugar daddy oh god.
  • YamazukiYamazuki ✭✭✭✭✭
    Yamazuki wrote: »
    kamizuma wrote: »
    LancerJiva wrote: »
    The people who complain about the economy have thousands of enchanting materials and are complaining that since the prices are so cheap, they cannot make anymore gold over it. At the current state, it benefits poor players and even new 65s. The ones that complain are the greedy rich players.

    Cheap enchanting materials benefit poor players/new 65s that don't have gold so they need to sell their mwa/feedstock to get said gold? Cheap enchanting materials are bad for rich players that can just buy them all out and progress even further in gear in a shorter amount of time and with less gold than in the past?

    Yeah, the problem isn't the cheap mats to buy, the problem is the low price to sell farmed mats. People are just looking at the low-priced consumables and thinking "it's good because I can buy things for cheap" -- but where does the gold to purchase those mats come from? Where is that money going? Where does the supply of consumables come from? The amount of straight gold you earn from vanguard and as drops isn't enough to pay for all the mats you need, so you'd need to be able to sell things, but you're making less. For F2P players without much gold, they probably don't have Elite either, so even their selling comes at a price. So even though the mats are cheap, there's no real way to get ahead -- unless you yourself hit the jackpot on an event (which masks the problem) or you sell EMP.

    That said, even if you do re-balance the supply, we still need to address the issue of the already-rich being able to control the market without any cost/penalty. As I've said before, even though it won't be popular, we need to add/increase the broker listing tax for Elite.

    You can sell a lot of other things that aren't feedstock/mwa. I don't know why people act like that's the only way to make gold. I do not sell enchanting materials ever and I still make more gold than is needed. Before 1 single DFNM per character per day for a long time earned you 2,000 gold until it dropped to under 1,000 gold, and even then. You could also have been doing IOD and selling the tears for 2,000+g ea or secrets for almost 4,000g ea. Then at the start of this patch you could sell the boxes for almost 4,000gea and the other for over 1,000gea along with the other mats that can be traded for over 100g ea and 2,000~3,000g ea. All these VM mats will earn you more gold than simply selling MWA or feedstock would. Currently you can get Ambush weapon design that sell for 500,000g to 1,000,000 depending on how early you sold it and class. I know people will say that requires you to win a roll, but not if you find 4 people to split since 500k to 1m split between 5 people is still 100k to 200k. Then during events, like the recent, you could have easily made a couple hundred thousand gold selling tokens, which is again far more than you could selling MWA or feedstock as an average person... Selling enchanting mats was always a bad way to make gold anyways as a person who isn't rich since you needed the enchanting mats yourself, how ever, what you could sell is any BiS related mat or cosmetics since these people aren't going for BiS any time soon.

    Well... I actually kind of agree with you on this point. Some people are a bit too dependant on being able to sell enchanting materials for their gold because that used to be a good way. Clearly it isn't a good way now, and you need to look for more creative ways. I think you've found a number of good ones, but I suspect part of the reason it works for you is that not everyone's thought of it yet. The more people are "in" on those secrets, the more difficult it'll be to make money those ways, so you constantly have to be searching and shifting based on supply and demand.

    (This is basically why I've always said that no broker fees are the true real value of Elite for people who know how to use it. Most people don't know how.)

    Even if more people did those they would still sell fairly high at the start due to being new. It's the same for new cosmetics, even when there's a ton of the loot boxes or smart boxes for them they sell absurdly high before completely dropping after the "newness" goes away. It's just a matter of whether you can take advantage of it or not in time. The issue comes down to many people being unwilling to well... put the effort into it. There's a reason people keep asking for the very rewarding Kyras, blue boxes, or even mongos. Kyras could be abused through CW, Mongos/Blue Boxes also were low effort. Getting Ambush designs and mats require you to do SSHM, SCHM, RMNM, LKHM, etc. EVen with the new mid tier gear and it being nerfed people are still failing SSHM... There was also GG before that was very rewarding yet people still never bothered with it. EVen during the 2 feedstock event people still had lacked feedstock because they didn't take advantage of it. I personally would've liked the system of bosses dropping x feedstock to everyone in the group to be permanent and remove the couple randomly distributed drops of 4 or so.

    Part of the issue though of course is that some of these events are essentially band-aid fixes as well.
  • Spacecats wrote: »
    Are you saying the amount of enchanting materials in Night of the Mandragora was too high, or are you just looking back at TERA Mongo?

    The majority of enchanting mats granted during this latest event were from Mandragora Boxes, and those contain a variety of items. The only Alkahest inside those is non-tradeable, Personal Alkahest. There are a lot of comments in this thread referencing Mongos, and the loot design in Mandragora was a direct result of TERA Mongo: Neon granting too many enchanting materials across the board.

    I second what Eiiji has stated. Don't listen to the trolls complaining. They just want to create a monopoly for the sake of making gold that they have no idea what to do with in the long run.
  • LockkOnLockkOn
    edited November 2016
    Honestly this just goes from one extreme to the other. "we want free mats" then it goes to "the designs dont drop enough for me to use my free mats" then once they do a 3x drop weekend "dammmmn I cant 15+ because its rigged." ...sighs. Now lets talk about those who successfully use all of this and get to +15. Are they out terrorizing the dungeons. Nope they 1. sell off the gear for a crap ton of gold (start of the patch), 2. complain there's not enough content and the game is to easy, or 3. AFK in highwatch.....the most likely of the 3 things listed.

    Point being that giving out more free stuff dont help the economy or the players. It just makes them burn through content faster. which = them playing another game, afking, or just quitting in general. Its funny that people ask for the things that cost the least lol. Im not going to even list the things that cost far more than mwa and feedstock. But people willingly pay the price for them and say much of nothing about XD. To me when i see the events i just ....sigh. Granted I participate in them but hell who would not. its free stuff.

    Now on another note. Lets talk about the people who exploit the heck out of the events that give enchanting mats. And ya know what im talking about. The people that have 5 accounts afkin in a raid...... Yes that reallllly helps the economy let me tell you. These people get crazy gold why? because its an item that in demand and its absolutely free. I agree with the entry curve being softer for new players. But not for the sake of those who are just exploiting the system and selling the mats for gold. Which more likely than not is the case. Not to mention the increased enabling of gold sellers by having these events. The list is long as to why the events should stop giving mats. Im sure enmasse did it with the players best interest in mind. However it does need some major adjusting.

    People talk down on enmasse, but I can say this. I have never seen a game manager interfere with the economy as much as they have. Be it for better or worst. Most cases sadly worst. The players should decide the economy. The saddest thing is seeing border line ingame well fare. Im not saying make it a grind fest. But seriously compared to the start of the game....mats are soooooo much easier to get. It just involves playing the game! Im not understanding why people are begging and yes im saying begging for more hand outs. If everything is given to you wheres the fun in that? This is something enmasse should take into consideration as well. They are also hurting themselves financially to by doing it. To me this is a loss all the way around. A loss for the community and for enmasse. Rather sad in my opinion.
  • edited November 2016
    LockkOn wrote: »
    Im not understanding why people are begging and yes im saying begging for more hand outs. If everything is given to you wheres the fun in that?
    I think Immisively's post above is actually a large part of the reason for this. The game itself is pitching that the process of getting the gear is "playing the game." But because of player behavior (wanting to put every instance on farm right away; not wanting to accept lowbies who have a chance of slowing them down), a lot of people feel like they need to already be geared in order be accepted in parties. This unintended paradox (need to run dungeons to get gear, but need gear to be accepted into parties to run dungeons) means that the game can only really start once they're geared. So anything that can help people to get to +15 without having to do the grind the regular way is welcomed -- even though this will mean, once done, people will go back to being AFK and have nothing to do.

    (If you're in a guild, people will know that you don't need top gear to do pretty much any of the dungeons. Most of the guild farm parties are in much worse gear. But in LFG nobody trusts anyone and they use gear as a means to discriminate even though it's absolutely not needed.)

    Basically, people consider the gearing process a hurdle to be cleared as fast as humanly possible, and a hindrance to "fun." This was always an issue to some degree, but really picked up in earnest once the game introduced +15 awakening enchanting (and the ability to liberate +15 gear), so the line between the "haves" and "have nots" became much more pronounced. Even as the game took various steps to reduce the importance of +15 gear, the stigma hasn't lessened. It probably doesn't help that a bunch of people probably want to prepare for the 30-man raid that is coming that's supposed to be hard enough to actually need some of this gear.
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