Tanks these days are fkin lazy

Zoknahal · November 2016

Tanks do not need extra aggro. If your tanks keeps aggrp constantly then is good, but if it doesnt happen like that, then there is a problem in the players skill with a tank. the only time i ever lose aggro is when someone in my party dies. Unfortunately that is intended, for the aggro to reset if someone dies, and is very annoying.

Generally speaking in terms of which tank is for you, on a personal scale:

- Brawler: easiest tank class to learn. All you do is faceroll all over your enemies.
- Berserker(?): Never tried one of these, but apparently they have the highest aggro generation of all tanks.
- Lancer: Requires player skill and good ping to be able to draw its maximum potential. A tank that can buff your party.
- Warrior: Hardest tank class to learn. You learn how to tank as a warrior and you enter swag realm. No really, tanking as a warrior requires a lot of skill and practice. They are not tanking right now, but im sure they will again once the warrior rework arrives to NA.

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

k. changed the title

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

now if they can do something about the playerbase then i'd be happy cause im not tanking with sorc.

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

though if they can bring back eclipse potion, i'd still use it. i'll use every help no matter how small the effect is. but still from what i observed as a dps comparing CU patch to Spellbound patch, there's really a big difference in tank aggro. I say it was better from CU patch, new or old dgns with same playerbase.

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

Zoknahal wrote: »

Tanks do not need extra aggro. If your tanks keeps aggrp constantly then is good, but if it doesnt happen like that, then there is a problem in the players skill with a tank. the only time i ever lose aggro is when someone in my party dies. Unfortunately that is intended, for the aggro to reset if someone dies, and is very annoying.

Generally speaking in terms of which tank is for you, on a personal scale:

- Brawler: easiest tank class to learn. All you do is faceroll all over your enemies.
- Berserker(?): Never tried one of these, but apparently they have the highest aggro generation of all tanks.
- Lancer: Requires player skill and good ping to be able to draw its maximum potential. A tank that can buff your party.
- Warrior: Hardest tank class to learn. You learn how to tank as a warrior and you enter swag realm. No really, tanking as a warrior requires a lot of skill and practice. They are not tanking right now, but im sure they will again once the warrior rework arrives to NA.

We're not talking about which tank is for us.. read our previous discussions. though this might be useful for the other readers but it should be on Player Guides discussion

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

hellno wrote: »

I think a lot of people forget or maybe they dont know, but when someone in your party dies it causes aggro to reset. So if someone dies and aggro switches to a DPS or healer, it isnt the tanks fault it is the person laying on the floors fault.

I'm well aware of that and it isn't the problem.

Neonie · November 2016

hellno wrote: »

I think a lot of people forget or maybe they dont know, but when someone in your party dies it causes aggro to reset. So if someone dies and aggro switches to a DPS or healer, it isnt the tanks fault it is the person laying on the floors fault.

That actually sounds like a terrible coding error. I wouldn't say that's the person on the floor's fault, so much as a horrible failure of game development. It's not the person who died's fault the game is coded like garbage in that way.

Yamazuki · November 2016

Neonie wrote: »

hellno wrote: »

I think a lot of people forget or maybe they dont know, but when someone in your party dies it causes aggro to reset. So if someone dies and aggro switches to a DPS or healer, it isnt the tanks fault it is the person laying on the floors fault.

That actually sounds like a terrible coding error. I wouldn't say that's the person on the floor's fault, so much as a horrible failure of game development. It's not the person who died's fault the game is coded like garbage in that way.

It's a form of punishment for dying, so yes, it is their fault for dying.

Dvsv · November 2016

feazeshero wrote: »

Welcome to the world of tanking and aggro management. If you never tanked back in the days before the aggro changes, then it's no surprise why some people tend to struggle tanking in the new meta. I'm not going to mention zerks or warriors in this post but I will mention that those 2 classes do a better job tanking than most brawler and lancers in the game because most times it's a skilled player behind it. I know this because I've seen this before with my own eyes.

When people tanked back in the days, especially as a lancer, we were in need of serious buffs but we were still able to do our job but had to work really hard for it. Even with people wearing eclipse potion, it was a struggle at times and even fun as well against skilled players but the job was still doable 99 percent of the time. However, right now people asking tanks needing more aggro in the new meta is ridiculous. There is enough aggro for tanks. I remember how people said it's so easy to keep aggro in the new system. How do people feel about that now with all the aggro struggling issues? Some people really need to becareful what they say if they don't know what they are doing as tanks.

Where the problem really relies is on the player's skill and determination as a tank. If the player is not aggressive enough as a tank, then it's no surprise why they are struggling to manage aggro. Tanks have to output a certain dps threshold, or else they cannot keep up with people hitting numbers like 11m-15m on their high skills attacks during full buffs. The lancers and brawlers who are doing somewhere around 1m-1.5m average dps, have no issue keeping aggro against dps who are doing 2m-3m average dps. It's simple really; damage = aggro. The more damage, the more aggro generation. Even when eclipse was available, there were people who were still struggling to keep aggro even while they have aggro crystal on their weapon. So what does that really say then?

The people who succeed as a tank are the ones who are always adjusting, learning, asking questions, researching many ways to improve, willing to be brave and try with skilled groups to see how far they can improve; while the ones who fail are the ones who don't make the effort to improve at all whatsoever. Some people are just not made for tanking and this is why a lot of people see many unskilled tanks in the game. There are just way too many reasons why there are a lack of good tanks on every server.

About brawlers needing more buff: They don't need anymore buffs but maybe some minor ones. At first, they were so dam powerful to begin with that they needed so many nerfs to balance between them and lancer class. Brawlers had it too easy when the class came out; literally almost everyone played that class that it was annoying to see really. People who never tanked in an MMO ever, started playing brawler and that was very bad. If people struggle keeping aggro as brawler now, don't blame it on the lack of buffs but rather their own lack of skillset. Try to feel what it's like to work hard to manage aggro like it was somewhat back in the days vs when brawler came out at first when it was too easy at first. Maybe brawler isn't really for that person anymore and it was more like a bandwagon class to begin with like for a lot of people. Same would apply if someone plays lancer. If you don't know the essence of tanking and how to be aggressive, then tanking isn't for you. Tanking should only be for the ones who are born with the natural instinct and mindset of tanking, and not for ones who pretend.

I think every single post that you made on this forum and on reddit we can resume on a simple thing: "Get gud"...
You think Tera is the perfect mmo with the best devs ever that know what they're doing and 99% of the playerbase are just retards..

Nah...

I got a +15 Imp sorc and sometimes i rip aggro from +15 imp brawlers, in fact, i think a +12 skilled lancer can hold my aggro with more consistency than most +15 brawlers..
It's just sad when the tank is a +12 brawler (even very good one), i just w8 for enrage to pop quatrefoil brooch + mana boost and by the time i finish one or two rotation, i'll be the tank.

That's something that i noticed since last patch when my main was a sf +15 slayer, but now it's so much worse cuz there's no more eclipse and i can double the dps of my slayer on my sorc..

Maybe...
It's unrealistic for most brawlers to keep GF 100% of the time every fight and BHS should balance things around this fact...
There's ppl with 100..200 ms that just can't play as aggressively as you can. In this case your "get gud" advice is useless.

Maybe BHS is the one that should "get gud" and balance their game....

Neonie · November 2016

Yamazuki wrote: »

Neonie wrote: »

hellno wrote: »

I think a lot of people forget or maybe they dont know, but when someone in your party dies it causes aggro to reset. So if someone dies and aggro switches to a DPS or healer, it isnt the tanks fault it is the person laying on the floors fault.

That actually sounds like a terrible coding error. I wouldn't say that's the person on the floor's fault, so much as a horrible failure of game development. It's not the person who died's fault the game is coded like garbage in that way.

It's a form of punishment for dying, so yes, it is their fault for dying.

No. Just NO.

That's absolutly mental, and 100% unjustifiable. That's not a punishment, it's literally a game breaking, terrible piece of code that might as well have been some developer have a mental break down or drunken stupor. Aggro should not reset because someone in the party died. That's completely idiotic. Nothing, literally nothing, about that is ok. That is not the players fault. The game should not work that way, at all.

Yamazuki · November 2016

Neonie wrote: »

Yamazuki wrote: »

Neonie wrote: »

hellno wrote: »

I think a lot of people forget or maybe they dont know, but when someone in your party dies it causes aggro to reset. So if someone dies and aggro switches to a DPS or healer, it isnt the tanks fault it is the person laying on the floors fault.

That actually sounds like a terrible coding error. I wouldn't say that's the person on the floor's fault, so much as a horrible failure of game development. It's not the person who died's fault the game is coded like garbage in that way.

It's a form of punishment for dying, so yes, it is their fault for dying.

No. Just NO.

That's absolutly mental, and 100% unjustifiable. That's not a punishment, it's literally a game breaking, terrible piece of code that might as well have been some developer have a mental break down or drunken stupor. Aggro should not reset because someone in the party died. That's completely idiotic. Nothing, literally nothing, about that is ok. That is not the players fault. The game should not work that way, at all.

I never said whether it should stay, or not. I was simply stating it's a punishment system set by them, and not an accident. It's common for games to have death penalties, and this one of the rare death penalties on Tera. It's also not really that bad considering all tanks soon can shout for guaranteed aggro anyways, effectively removing another penalty for dying if they pay attention. With a good tank even when someone dies aggro rarely switches to someone else to begin with.

aeee98 · November 2016

Also, death resetting aggro has been something most tanks have been handling for a very long time. Yes it may sound stupid, but turning it into a mech makes it easier to handle.

Brawler's DPS nerf made it such that you MUST use a threatening when you are more than a tier lower. It is not just because someone can't get good, its just their overall dps aggro generation fell by nearly a third.

Oh and to clarify OP's point about Sorc being bad in PvP now, people can't make super fast and flashy plays anymore, which was the main reason why sorcs were strong in PvP pre rework.

Boomeh · November 2016

I agree about tanks needing to play more aggressively. I noticed after sorcer revamp that good sorcs and other classes, even zerkers were getting aggro from me when i was able to hold against tryhards back in sshm patch without issues at all, but i also noticed i was doing average 400-500k/s dps on my end, then i started to play more aggressively by focusing more on my dmg output and ended up on 600k to almost 900k/s on some bosses. I dont have aggro issues anymore unless i die due to ping spikes or i get lazy on Shield counter/Spring attacks.

dinners · November 2016

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

Looks like no one started a thread about this.

I'm a lv65 sorc with +15sf weap and +12gloves(both PvE rolls and keen2 etch), +12guilie armor and boots. I'd say a mid-tier gear with decent build and using Yosha's basic PvE skill rotation.

I've been doing IM dgns up to SCHM and most of the tanks are just horrible at holding aggro, I understand the consequences of IM but this is just ridiculous. ran with +15impe weap and gloves brawler and just with full mana boost rotation i stole it right away even if i only did a decent dps -.- I dont usually do LFG's because people are dicks, looking for elites only and i usually double queue dungeons and battlegrounds. It's been [filtered] for me to get the new tier gears. They(BHS) should've at least considered Eclipse potion, knowing there are still people gearing up and learning. And sorc in PvP sucks [filtered]. zzz

-You should try tanking then.
- I think, you don't know about agro system in Tera.
1. If someone die in party, agro may randomly moves to another party member.
2. If 2 other dps party member do much less dps than your total dps, then you get more chance to still agro from tank.
3. Sorc and Ninja can deal tons of damage on boss in short of period. Sometimes, my +12 Guild Sorc steal agro from +15 brawler/ tank too. It doesn't mean they are lazy or bad.
4. Mana problem. Simply, Nostrum is alot better than Infusion charm. Priest's mana charge is alot better too. I have used lots mana pot when I play Lancer. Lancer use more Mana pot than Brawler. Still, brawler used to pop mana potion more often.

-At least try tank class. then make complains. You are playing one of the easiest class and complains to tank? I use Stone skins before I make complains to tank.

VvUnforgivenvV · November 2016

If you are a pro tank you use a threatening crystal. If you are pro tank you are extremely aggressive on attack the boss. Pro tanks run with pro dps. Pro dps require a threatening crystal be used by the tank to control the boss properly and maximize party dps. Too many classes burst truck loads of dps when the boss is properly occupied. Archers, Warriors, Ninjas, Sorcs, even some Zerks and Reapers will erode away your aggro reserve if you don't use a threatening crystal. There ability to dps is more important than any tank dps.

Lancers and Brawlers can get by without it when running with average dps parties only because they have aggro rolled native into their weapons. If you try tanking on a Zerk or Warrior without an aggro Crystal... please stop tanking as you are the problem and the ones who give real warrior and zerk tanks a bad name. You also can't build Warrior or Zerk Tanks like you do Lancer and Brawler tanks and hope to get the same result.
All the tank classes require a different setup to maximize their result when tanking and lots of understanding of the class.

Lancers will always be the prime tank. If you wanna be legendary be a lancer. Requires skill and that skill is rewarded in results.

Brawlers are face rolls entry-level tank class with broken dps output. I call them front dps with a side of tanking. Do this is you're new to Tera ad want to tank max level dungeons with less effort learning.

Zerk and Warrior are more swag and style point tanks. They both can generate tons of aggro just with a lower dps contribution while tanking. Parties still run quite smooth and quick with either class as tank. You will get lots of shine for if you are masochistic enough to polish your skills and understanding to carry HM dungeons on these classes. Decent overall but not great tanks, but high fun factor for the veteran player.

Tanks these days are fkin lazy

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