Tanks these days are fkin lazy

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

dinners wrote: »

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

I'm a lv65 sorc with +15sf weap and +12gloves(both PvE rolls and keen2 etch), +12guilie armor and boots. I'd say a mid-tier gear with decent build and using Yosha's basic PvE skill rotation.

I've been doing IM dgns up to SCHM and most of the tanks are just horrible at holding aggro, I understand the consequences of IM but this is just ridiculous. ran with +15impe weap and gloves brawler and just with full mana boost rotation i stole it right away even if i only did a decent dps -.- I dont usually do LFG's because people are dicks, looking for elites only and i usually double queue dungeons and battlegrounds. It's been [filtered] for me to get the new tier gears. They(BHS) should've at least considered Eclipse potion, knowing there are still people gearing up and learning. And sorc in PvP sucks [filtered]. zzz

-You should try tanking then.
- I think, you don't know about agro system in Tera.
1. If someone die in party, agro may randomly moves to another party member.
2. If 2 other dps party member do much less dps than your total dps, then you get more chance to still agro from tank.
3. Sorc and Ninja can deal tons of damage on boss in short of period. Sometimes, my +12 Guild Sorc steal agro from +15 brawler/ tank too. It doesn't mean they are lazy or bad.
4. Mana problem. Simply, Nostrum is alot better than Infusion charm. Priest's mana charge is alot better too. I have used lots mana pot when I play Lancer. Lancer use more Mana pot than Brawler. Still, brawler used to pop mana potion more often.

-At least try tank class. then make complains. You are playing one of the easiest class and complains to tank? I use Stone skins before I make complains to tank.

LOL why would i even bother trying to tank. have you read our previous discussions? I'm well aware of the systems, if they can't catch up to my DPS then that's their problem and it's bullsht to hold back my DPS(hence the stone skin) just for them to catch up. mana problems? idc 'cause that's not my problem and sorc have gone more into mana problems than any other classes. All i see are excuses for a bad tank.

Sorc one of the easiest class? LOOOOOOLLLL do you even know your class? it's still the 2nd tier hardest class to play even when revamp mate. ffs

aeee98 · November 2016

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

Sorc one of the easiest class? LOOOOOOLLLL do you even know your class? it's still the 2nd tier hardest class to play even when revamp mate. ffs

Nope.

Only reason why it is "hard" is because you can't use fireball.

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

aeee98 wrote: »

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

Sorc one of the easiest class? LOOOOOOLLLL do you even know your class? it's still the 2nd tier hardest class to play even when revamp mate. ffs

Nope.

Only reason why it is "hard" is because you can't use fireball.

Warrior>Sorc>the rest of the class. It has always been that way. If you don't think so, you've gotten used to sorc.

feazeshero · November 2016

VvUnforgivenvV wrote: »

If you are a pro tank you use a threatening crystal. If you are pro tank you are extremely aggressive on attack the boss. Pro tanks run with pro dps. Pro dps require a threatening crystal be used by the tank to control the boss properly and maximize party dps. Too many classes burst truck loads of dps when the boss is properly occupied. Archers, Warriors, Ninjas, Sorcs, even some Zerks and Reapers will erode away your aggro reserve if you don't use a threatening crystal. There ability to dps is more important than any tank dps

I would assume Pro tank in your wording means average or lesser tank. Threatening is for people who have trouble with aggro, don't have full understanding of their own dps rotations, new to tanking or if there are other tanks in the party to hold aggro against. I usually have run a lot of hard mode dungeons with skilled dps who usually have done around 1.5m-2m or higher dps and never needed threatening; never have aggro issues unless people start dying a lot but it's not an issue most times to get aggro back.

I don't think I ever used threatening since the old days unless there was a brawler in the party as a dps. Just because a tank uses threatening, doesn't mean that it will help them by much unless they are aggressive as you mention. Tanks have to do certain amount of dps to uphold the skilled dps. Most pro tanks don't even use threatening but go with double pounding (or pounding and carving), focused and wrathful. They like to prioritze and maximize their min-max capability on their class.

feazeshero · November 2016

streetdog wrote: »

feazeshero wrote: »

Welcome to the world of tanking and aggro management. If you never tanked back in the days before the aggro changes, then it's no surprise why some people tend to struggle tanking in the new meta. I'm not going to mention zerks or warriors in this post but I will mention that those 2 classes do a better job tanking than most brawler and lancers in the game because most times it's a skilled player behind it. I know this because I've seen this before with my own eyes.

When people tanked back in the days, especially as a lancer, we were in need of serious buffs but we were still able to do our job but had to work really hard for it. Even with people wearing eclipse potion, it was a struggle at times and even fun as well against skilled players but the job was still doable 99 percent of the time. However, right now people asking tanks needing more aggro in the new meta is ridiculous. There is enough aggro for tanks. I remember how people said it's so easy to keep aggro in the new system. How do people feel about that now with all the aggro struggling issues? Some people really need to becareful what they say if they don't know what they are doing as tanks.

Where the problem really relies is on the player's skill and determination as a tank. If the player is not aggressive enough as a tank, then it's no surprise why they are struggling to manage aggro. Tanks have to output a certain dps threshold, or else they cannot keep up with people hitting numbers like 11m-15m on their high skills attacks during full buffs. The lancers and brawlers who are doing somewhere around 1m-1.5m average dps, have no issue keeping aggro against dps who are doing 2m-3m average dps. It's simple really; damage = aggro. The more damage, the more aggro generation. Even when eclipse was available, there were people who were still struggling to keep aggro even while they have aggro crystal on their weapon. So what does that really say then?

The people who succeed as a tank are the ones who are always adjusting, learning, asking questions, researching many ways to improve, willing to be brave and try with skilled groups to see how far they can improve; while the ones who fail are the ones who don't make the effort to improve at all whatsoever. Some people are just not made for tanking and this is why a lot of people see many unskilled tanks in the game. There are just way too many reasons why there are a lack of good tanks on every server.

About brawlers needing more buff: They don't need anymore buffs but maybe some minor ones. At first, they were so dam powerful to begin with that they needed so many nerfs to balance between them and lancer class. Brawlers had it too easy when the class came out; literally almost everyone played that class that it was annoying to see really. People who never tanked in an MMO ever, started playing brawler and that was very bad. If people struggle keeping aggro as brawler now, don't blame it on the lack of buffs but rather their own lack of skillset. Try to feel what it's like to work hard to manage aggro like it was somewhat back in the days vs when brawler came out at first when it was too easy at first. Maybe brawler isn't really for that person anymore and it was more like a bandwagon class to begin with like for a lot of people. Same would apply if someone plays lancer. If you don't know the essence of tanking and how to be aggressive, then tanking isn't for you. Tanking should only be for the ones who are born with the natural instinct and mindset of tanking, and not for ones who pretend.

What you are saying is sorta true, however you ignore the fact that for brawler do do 1,5m/s he needs to keep GF on. Certain bosses do not allow you do keep GF 100% of the time, because you have to do mechanics. Most notorious example is Imperator from SSHM, where unless you have very good team to push through shields, you will lose GF. Same goes for the second boss.
Sometimes on Atrocitas it is not possible to keep GF too, if he doesn't specific combos or just because you fail to change colors, which is not necessarily related to skill but more to ping and desyncronization.
I assure you I play as aggressive as possible on brawler, skills are always on cd and they are properly casted, and it is still not possible to keep aggro well enough without GF. If a class is built around GF to do properly his job, then something is not right.

And yes, brawler needs more than small buff, and not because of the aggro issues, but because his raw dps cannot compensate for the utility the lancer can bring to the team, resulting in higher team dps with lancer tank, even if the brawler plays properly and does 1,5m/s+.

Yes I forgot to mention about GF. I thought I included that in there. That is true keeping GF is really difficult. I think they should buff the GF a bit in a way where losing it is not as hard or something because at some bosses it's very tough to maintain.

T3DFEEXCRH · November 2016

Not sure about 2m dps, maybe up to 1.5m I managed to hold agro on lancer without a threat niveot in guile however I glyth more agro (shield barrage, shield counter) due to 2 things, I have 130 ms so my rotations are slow i barely get opportunitys to use onslaught I also tend to fly through bosses when I use it sometimes.

Zerk tank is horrible, you can't attack while blocking like brawler and you can't do much between boss animations like lancers shield counter (damage comparison) you can get in some thunderstrikes but....
Zerk yes is easy to hold agro due to agro generation however I really don't recommend it, you will have more fun taking an archer with front crit and threat crystal and attempting to face tank the boss and hold agro (you will have more fun on the floor watching your team)
I zerk tank when the tank dc's also I zerk tank'd during Tshm/Schm

Minazuki · November 2016

How to lose aggro on Tera as a tank?
BEING LAZY
About the aggro crystal.. sorry it not really needed while I never bother aggro tanking gear either. I been tank with full dps gear/crystal since 2012...

5H96Y49G6D · November 2016

sooooooo.......2 things pro tanks use aggro crystal and Lancers can get aggro easily back with just shouting after some1 dies:

Ladies n gentlemen [filtered] like this misinformation is why Tera has so many [filtered] tanks and LFG is all SSHM/RMHM/SCHM/ LKHM N>T

YDLY7L7EM6 · November 2016

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

Looks like no one started a thread about this.
And sorc in PvP sucks [filtered]. zzz

don't say a class is bad at pvp if u actually don't know how to play it ....

Kimimishan · November 2016

if they can't catch up to my DPS then that's their problem

I dont usually do LFG's because people are dicks, looking for elites only

I found "a" problem, not the one you're looking for however. At least I hope you won't feel like you don't belong in IM anymore.

T5P669R3CF · November 2016

YDLY7L7EM6 wrote: »

T5P669R3CF wrote: »

Looks like no one started a thread about this.
And sorc in PvP sucks [filtered]. zzz

don't say a class is bad at pvp if u actually don't know how to play it ....

Please, I've been sorc for 2yrs, played thousand times of FWC and i can say that it's really bad. don't throw me that "You don't know how to play" bullsht. Especially a mana boosted Meteor Strike. Slow as sht, easy to escape, damage??? even Onisor said it.

Kimimishan wrote: »

if they can't catch up to my DPS then that's their problem

I dont usually do LFG's because people are dicks, looking for elites only

I found "a" problem, not the one you're looking for however. At least I hope you won't feel like you don't belong in IM anymore.

I dont really see how that's my problem, not being an elitist or whatever but im just doing my "job" as a DPS and holding back isn't one of it. And im not complaining that I belong in IM. heck, that's the reason why i made this topic in the first place.

Yithar · November 2016

Yamazuki wrote: »

Eclipse Potion is just a scapegoat, it would have no impact in most cases as I had used it sometimes when I used IMS, and surprise surprise, still had aggro as a dps. The issue also isn't tanks not generating enough aggro, it's just people not playing aggressive, which has nothing at all to do with gear. A lot of tanks expect tanking to work like 'traditional' mmos, when that's not how it is on Tera. They could also use a threatening crystal as suggested above, but even then, it won't get rid of the excessive passive problem.

The thing is when they buffed aggro formula, they increased the decay a lot, which means you have to be more aggressive than before.

But I digress. It's pretty much a skill problem.

ILikeTeddyBears · November 2016

Yithar wrote: »

Yamazuki wrote: »

Eclipse Potion is just a scapegoat, it would have no impact in most cases as I had used it sometimes when I used IMS, and surprise surprise, still had aggro as a dps. The issue also isn't tanks not generating enough aggro, it's just people not playing aggressive, which has nothing at all to do with gear. A lot of tanks expect tanking to work like 'traditional' mmos, when that's not how it is on Tera. They could also use a threatening crystal as suggested above, but even then, it won't get rid of the excessive passive problem.

The thing is when they buffed aggro formula, they increased the decay a lot, which means you have to be more aggressive than before.

But I digress. It's pretty much a skill problem.

ayy you're back

Brawlerrr · November 2016

go play a tank and try hold argo pls

Shunkou · November 2016

I completely disagree with your point of view... "A complete mana boost rotation", at wich point? When you have started the boss, and the tank is just building aggro yet?
Or when the tank is positioning, because of some mechanics?

SCHM is not a "Hard DPS" dungeon, and because of this the majority of tanks can't hold aggro... they can't stop to evade/skip/run because you're already 20m away from the boss DPSing non-stopping.

If that's not your case, my apologies. But as a tank, I really got MANY DPS that do exactly what I said, and because of them, the tank loses aggro, they got hitted, run away from the tank, making him chase to try to regain aggro, run to the healer, kill the healer, kill themselves, and wipe, and in the end: "Noob Tank can't hold aggro while running from the twist mechanic that deals 1m damage in a 20m area that I can safely continue to spam skills dealing a 'decent' 5m hits on boss"

Tanks these days are fkin lazy

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