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Comments
They expect people go get Imperator +15 before going for Ambush.
But see, that's what I said in my previous post, people are told that it's not worth getting Imp if you have full Guile. So now we have conflicting information.
Different people tend to say different things. It's normally better to go 2nd best first unless you have a ton of resources (or connections), although if you're stuck with Guile then chances are you don't have a ton of resources (or connections).
Aside for tanks, melees have abilities to instantly get them out of the inner ring, and can prepare earlier since the boss won't follow them. Ninja can impact bomb and be basically on the outer ring nearly, Zerker/Slayer have Dash to run faster which can be used early and then they have a dash ability as well that essentially takes them out. Warrior would probably have the hardest time of the melee dps due to their dash being apart of their rotation, however, you can always just not use when the mechanic is coming up. The mechanic has a timer and can be counted.
As for the attack that can kill melees, I don't think it's a bug, as it's just a frimbrilisk, and those bams, like giants, tend to hit behind them on some attacks, and I don't even think the attack hits the tank and actually is focused on the back, particularly one side of the back as you don't get hit if you're on the other side. Unfortunately I can't specifically tell you which side since I tanked RMHM for almost every single run, so difficult to explain from a dps perspective. I got very confused the few times I did it as a dps lol
It's not just different people, but the progression guide, too, that says to get either one.
OK cuz I'm bored:
1. Most guides on Tera are outdated
2. Speed runs not the norm ppl brag
3. Most guides are designed by cocky elitist who live breathe [filtered] this game so their expectations or whats reasonable may not apply to you
EX: There was a Lancer guide on the popular essential mania that used to say roll 9% atk speed top line. Presently guide was taken down and now the new guide pretty much says roll double 9.3% and [filtered] 9% atk speed not really needed git gud. Ninjas with exceptionally low ping and hax can do game breaking DPS. Does the popular guide work for the low aka 20ish ping macro abuser? Some DPS prefer crit and say that nolife warrior crit vs power guide applies to all classes.
Get the point moving on.....
4. Speculation vs facts.
EX: You are right everyone on this forum pretty much were spouting crap like Guile > Starfall and that Imp only slightly stronger than Starfall. Patch comes and both Guile/ Starfall can't break LKHM shield wake up call. Majority of people here know [filtered] and purely anecdotal myself included. To show you how broken VM weapons are, my DPS with guile lance is mostly 400-500k/s. I slap on IMP and yes my DPS freaking doubled to 700-1m+/s depending on boss of course with 9% atk speed. A 20% increase or 10% here n there does not mean you are literally 20% stronger. It means your damage bloody doubles.
5. Gear progression vs Reality (mentality in-game)
The same people who make those hypocritical BS guides are the very Elitist who run only in statics and exclude noobs period and do something stupid like trial runs PVE heroes so hardcore. Why in the world would you like sheep still follow in their footsteps when you are not even at their level. When they LFG they reject you and if you do join blacklist you for being trap or make youtube vids exposing how much you suck for all their Elite PVE heroes to see. If you want real advice don't go online, but ask people you will be spend the majority of your time with. If you meet their expectations which often the case should be bare minimum, they will help you grow and they with you. Honestly its PVE no one cares if you clear a HM in 8m instead of 4m. A clear is a clear.
6. Getting IMP
Imp weapons were fairly easy to get past month and weapon designs are cheap. For some reason the cost of weapons are decreasing as VM 8.5 approaches. If you are serious about Tera like I sated earlier, You should be Elite and participating in these events or when Mongo crap occurs. You Also should realize that doing PVP dailies a day for 30 days will net you enough gold to buy Elite vouchers still and more. That means after 1 month of Elite you should have enough gold to purchase 1 VM weapon and perhaps an VM chest. Its still f2p and yes it will take time, but lets not forget if we are following Nexons guide to doing things, RMHM is going to be the HM dungeon for the next 5-6months or more so you have plenty of time.
Yes, you get either one. That's what a guide is, to guide you, not make a decision for you. If you have the resources and the connections, you get Ambush. If you don't, you get Imperator. There's no point in going for Ambush if you can't clear RMHM, or even have the gold/resources for all the tier 11 feedstock. T11 costs twice as much as t10, in addition to RMHM being harder than SSHM and SSNM. If you can't clear RMHM then you have to be able to afford hundreds of boxes as well. If you can't do any of that, then get Imperator. People often like to go for something they can't even afford, which makes no sense.
No, I mean the guide says to get either Guile +12 or Imp +15 before starting on Ambush, and while it's true it's only a guide, for someone who doesn't know the game inside out, it's kind of a given that they'll rely on guides and/or forums.
The progression guide is up to date (hell, it even includes something on the VM8.5). I'm not talking about speed running or even class specific guides, here, I'm talking about the progression guide, which helps people by saying where and how to gear up at 65. There's only so much elitism that can go into it.
Anyway, I got myself a +15 Imp weapon, and while I noticed an slight increase in damage, it definitely wasn't doubled (also, a 20% increase doesn't double your damage, that'd be a 100% increase).
About following guides or asking online, isn't that what new players are supposed to bloody do? How is asking other players who do not know any more than you (and sometimes less) any help? Not everyone knows someone who can run RMHM in their sleep.
The site with the guide has information on the mats for Ambush, and Imperator, unless you're not talking about the one on Essential Mana... Also, their gear guide does say not to get Ambush if you're broke as well. They say Guile->Imperator->Ambush, in which case, if you followed it, you would be in RMNM with Imperator and not Guile, since Guile drops in SSNM/LKNM with Imperator mats being found in SSNM, SCHM, SSHM.
You would basically go CW/KC/DFNM (Slaughter and starter jewels)->SSNM/LKNM/VoK/DFHM (Guile and mid jewels)->SSHM/SCHM/SSNM (Imperator mats and higher jewels)->RMNM/RMHM/LKHM (Ambush mats and higher jewels) with IoD on the side. Plenty of people also go to RMNM/RMHM with Guile anyways, but again, that's a matter of luck or having connections. If you can prove you can compete with the mediocre +15 players in mid tier gear then people will gladly take you.
You can rely on a guide, but at the end of the day a guide is nothing more than information to guide you, as in help you come to a decision, not make one for you. It's on the player to make their own decisions, and if they choose to go with what ever someone with 1,000,000 times the resources they have, then that becomes their own issue, they just have no right to complain if they're rejected from groups for doing so.
There's also the issue of people wanting to take short cuts as well. They want to go Idoneal->Guile->Ambush, rather than Idoneal->Slaughter->Guile->Imperator->Ambush.
Where they clearly say "After obtaining +12 Guile or +15 Imperator (VM7), all uncommon and rare Master Glyphs and new accessories, the grind can begin for the best-in-slot gear: Ambush (VM8).", indicating that the Guile -> Ambush shortcut is valid, and not just for skilled players. I mean, it's fine if it isn't, it should probably be indicated somewhere, is all. That would reduce the number of casual people trying to go into RMHM with just Guile.
As for relying on a guide... What else can I do? Guile seems to have higher stats than Imperator on paper, so if you go with that alone, Guile seems better than Imp, and it's only through the extra enchant line, +15, 3% MW and actual play-testing that Imp gets the edge, but to know that without external info, you have to take the chance and get Imp, which I doubt is something most players would do.
They do have a right to complain if they're not given the chance to prove that they can hold their own, though, and that's my point. I understand that people don't want to waste a run due to a potential floormaster, but really, shouldn't people be given the benefit of the doubt?
Yes, the shortcut is valid, if you have the resources to do so (you don't have to be skilled, you can buy all the materials to make it if you're rich), the very guide you reference says to go for Imperator if you're poor. The guide specifies Imperator is better, and people are usually told Imperator is better. They still choose to skip Imperator anyways, because why bother going through +15 and rolling Imperator when you can skip to Ambush and save lots of gold, time and resources, right?
For the reliance part, as I said, you can use guides for information, but not to make decisions for you. At the end of the day, which is the best decision is ultimately based on your situation. Some people can go from Idoneal right to Ambush because they sell EMP, others can skip Guile and Imp on a character because they're loaded with gold from playing for 3 yrs, etc. Take any information you get, and form a decision based on your status. If you need help making a decision, it's best to ask someone directly what to do, because a guide isn't going to help you there.
You can prove you're competent without wasting people's time, the issue is, doing that is a waste of the person's time that is trying to prove anything. They want to skip right to RM without taking the steps to do so. People who want to take shortcuts need to accept the consequences for doing so. Either that, or pay people to run with them to compensate for time lost. These random people aren't given anything in return if the person in question turns out to be an absolute floor mat, in addition to any possible drama with dealing with randoms. I understand it's difficult to prove you're not like the average person with mid tier gear, as I had been in that situation myself, however, despite the fact I had no friends, no connections, and I don't talk much, I was still able to show I can be useful to them despite my gear being trash. My RMHM static was the same, none of them were geared, or even a veteran tera player, and 2 started this last month, and yet we run RMHM together just fine because they all showed a form of competence in SS, LKHM, and later RMNM, in addition to being willing to follow directions.
Yes, they showed they were good enough before RMHM. Unfortunately for me, the people I ran SS and LK with aren't available anymore, so it's back to randoms for me. Well, at least it should be easier now that I have a +15 Imp weapon.